On the Houston Rockets’ quest for Carmelo Anthony

http://youtu.be/5-HQalnoW6k

There was an interesting segment the other night on TNT’s Inside the NBA, discussing the Houston Rockets’ quest for a third star.  Howard Beck, formerly of The New York Times, mentioned Rajon Rondo, Dirk, Chris Bosh, Carmelo Anthony, and even Lebron James as possible targets for Houston this offseason.  None of this is really earth-shattering.  Daryl Morey’s belief that this team is still missing a “third star” has been publicly documented.  But should the Rockets pursue a third gun and if so, who would be the best target and can any of them even be had?

To begin, it should be clear: when Mr. Morey speaks of adding a third star, that notion is not dismissive of the prospect of internal growth.  The likeliest candidates there would be Chandler Parsons, Jeremy Lin, and Terrence Jones.  But having watched the three closely for a sizable sample, can one feel any confidence in expected trajectory?  Parsons lacks the physical gifts to do much more than he already is doing.  Jones will eventually fill out as a dependable role-player, but he too lacks the physical tools to ever be considered a “star.”  For now, simply not being an abomination defensively would be a noble start.  And Lin, for his gifts–few point guards possess his combination of quickness, size, and strength–probably lacks the overall composure/confidence to be more than a sparkplug, at least in this setting, on this team.  (I still do think that like Steve Francis, if handed the reins to a team, Lin can be its best player, guiding it to a low-40′s record.  That will not happen here and I do believe that a change of scenery would be best for both parties.)

Is the acquisition of a third star a wise course of action?  The alternative would be dispersing the third max slot between two ‘medium-salaried’ players, as the team is structured now with Jeremy Lin and Omer Asik both on the books at roughly $8million (as distinct from each player’s $15million real-money entitlement.)  Both sides of the coin hold merit.  There is much truth to the logic that a true-max player (along with a minimum salaried player) is the best value contract in the league.  The thinking would thus go that fitting as many max salaried players into one’s cap would yield the highest utility from resources spent.  In the alternative, the coexistence of three max players can often lead to the marginalization of the third, a noted inefficiency in resource allocation.  To illustrate, most would agree that while Miami’s Chris Bosh has been immensely valuable during that team’s title runs, he hasn’t produced to the fullest extent of his capabilities.  (The case of Miami is ironically instructive in that it can serve as the blueprint for either side of the argument: the Heat won two titles with three stars; the Heat barely won two titles while having three stars and only did win because they had the potential GOAT.)

The solution to this quandary is ‘fit’, or, synergistic value.  The Boston Celtics were able to maximize the utility of each of their stars because each player filled a well-defined, unique niche, complementing the other two players’ strengths and weaknesses.  To put it simply, Garnett held down the defense at an elite level, Pierce created off the dribble at an elite level, and Ray Allen shot threes at an elite level.  Would having Carmelo Anthony and James Harden together fit this model?

It is my belief that the greatest downside to the Rockets’ early exit from the postseason is that a sufficiently sizable sample of data regarding the team was not allowed to accrue.  Subsequently, the danger lies in forming erroneous conclusions on the basis of insufficient data.  Illustrative of this point is the case of Dwight Howard: while he produced at the expected rate of a max-player, I do not think he can be depended upon to produce similarly in later situations.  (This is not meant as an indictment of Howard, so please don’t let emotions cloud your analysis.)  One really does not need to look any further than the games against the Thunder and Clippers this season for a peak into Howard’s expected return against those teams.  My point here is that while much is made about the Rockets’ defensive woes (and rightfully so), I also think it is not accurate to say they are set offensively to win a championship.  The Rockets’ system and roster suffices to produce one of the league’s best offenses in the aggregate, on the strength of strong production early in games.  That all comes sputtering to a halt close and late when Howard is typically rendered useless (unless facing a favorable matchup such as Portland), Chandler Parsons’ physical inabilities become a hindrance, and Jeremy Lin and Terrence Jones (if even on the court) collectively wet the bed.  Defenses key in on Harden, and…well…you’ve seen what happens.  It is my belief that much of the defensive problems can be corrected through proper coaching.  This is a different topic altogether.  But offense is, for the most part, a personnel issue.

So what to make of the prospects?  The prospect of James doesn’t really merit an academic discussion.  If he can be had, it will be done.  But what of Rondo, Dirk, Bosh, and Anthony?  I don’t think Nowitzki either is a realistic target as I don’t see him ever leaving Dallas.  Bosh’s future hinges on James.  If Lebron goes elsewhere, Bosh certainly leaves the Heat.  The Heat, with their roster dismantled, would have no interest in paying Omer Asik and Jeremy Lin, and thus, would balk at a sign&trade offer.  Couple this with the fact that Lebron won’t be leaving (Cleveland was the only realistic expectation and they still suck) and Bosh–while in theory the perfect fit–is a very, very long shot.

That leaves Rondo and Anthony, the former of whom Beck reported to be “very unlikely” as a Rockets acquisition.  Would Melo make sense?  I think it’s an absolute no-brainer.

Some readers mentioned that acquiring Melo would kill the Durant 2016 dream, a point with which, while true, I have to take exception.  Durant is certainly a worthy goal and given his relationship with Harden, not as far-fetched a target as it would seem.  But maintaining the flexibility to sign Durant would mean foregoing later acquisitions for another two more seasons.  That means two more years of Dwight Howard’s prime, wasted.  (To clarify, once Houston’s foundation is set, it can exceed the cap and dip into luxury tax levels by pursuing players using the Mid-Level exception without fear of sacrificing flexibility.  Right now, the Rockets cannot sign players above the league minimum (much less even re-sign Chandler Parsons) because they have an eye towards cap space in 2015.)  The Rockets have to splurge now before they run out of time.

I’ve explained at length on these pages why I believe Anthony would be an almost ideal fit on the Rockets.  If played at the ’4′, he would give the team a weapon to counter the superstar power forwards in the West that torture them regularly.  We saw against Portland that even the combination of Dwight Howard and Omer Asik–two of the game’s best interior defenders–was not enough to shut down LaMarcus Aldridge.  Having Anthony would at least make players of that ilk work at the other end, rather than being able to rest up on defense.  The thinking goes that if you can’t stop them, at least make them stop you too.  And there isn’t a single power forward alive, or even person for that matter, who can guard Carmelo Anthony.

Anthony would give the team another crunch-time option.  He can operate from the mid-range, the area most free when smart defenses tighten up.  He’s also surprisingly efficient when spotting up, something he did regularly at the Olympics and would have the opportunity to do here in Houston.  (Anthony scored 1.08 PPP when spotting up this year, good for 80th in the league.)

I also don’t think defense would be as great a concern as critics of an Anthony pursuit have made it out to be.  To be sure, as a power forward, he wouldn’t be any worse than Jones who is, at least when inside, borderline atrocious.  But more than that, the Rockets will have to address their scheme and coaching staff to get at the heart of their defensive problems.  Right now, the Rockets don’t even have a coherent scheme, it seems.  Adding Anthony’s offense would do more in the aggregate than adding a defensive player and what Anthony lacks can somewhat be mitigated by proper coaching; the opposite does not hold true.

So how would Houston go about acquiring Carmelo Anthony?  One of two things would need to happen.  They would either need to trade both Omer Asik and Jeremy Lin (creating the sufficient cap room on their own) or convince the Knicks to agree to a sign&trade deal.  Anthony, of course, would need to desire to come here.  The first route would be tricky because it is difficult to envision any team taking on Jeremy Lin unless netting significant assets from the Rockets for the favor.  The sign&trade route, however, seems plausible because it does not seem too unrealistic to see the Knicks trading back for Lin for another year of Linsanity to fill the coffers in an expected down year.  That route could also prevent Anthony from fleeing to the Bulls, a conference rival.

Understand, this is not a pipe-dream, at all.  Anthony to the Rockets is an extremely realistic scenario.  Whether it happens, we will have to wait and see, but like last year, we are gearing up for yet another interesting offseason.

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Total comments: 306
  • slick shoes says 1 month ago

    Old vid, seen it a while ago, *yawn*


    I didn't realize age had anything to do with relevance.
  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago

    I'm just gonna leave this here...


    Old vid, seen it a while ago, *yawn*
  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @slick shoes

    lol he's not taking that 41 point ass whipping personal is he? :lol:

  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    I think the 25th will have to be included to dump lin, but we should recuperate our losses by gaining a future 1st with an asik trade.

  • majik19 says 1 month ago

    Could happen, but we would most likely have to dump the 25th too, which which we would have to anyway for more cap space.

    Unless we need the 25th to trade Lin (or sweeten the pot in a different trade), I would expect we would pick a foreign player to stash. (Or ask a US player to play overseas... I know we did that with a draft pick not too long ago, but I can't remember who it was).

  • slick shoes says 1 month ago

    I TOLD EVERYONE, Melos a big market player. Nothing like playing for a city like NY! Houston's small time! Https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ec7DAf2EY4

    I'm just gonna leave this here...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQu_T6-tBZk

    [NSFW> Lots of F-Bombs and other colorful language. Do Not Click if you have aversions to such things.

  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    Could happen, but we would most likely have to dump the 25th too, which which we would have to anyway for more cap space.

  • majik19 says 1 month ago

    It's kind of silly to weigh the merits of the city of Houston vs. Portland vs. New York... Every free agent (and player) in the world is going to form their own opinions and we don't have any insight into how Carmelo feels about Houston crime or Portland rain...

    Anywho, I'd never give up a 1st rounder for Shumpert. I'd give a 2nd. He's overrated because he plays in New York (and he barely played last year).

    I have trouble gauging if Phil Jackson would have interest in Lin. The triangle doesn't require a pure point guard, so that's good. But I do think they need to be able to shoot, so that's not so good. I'm assuming Linsanity has no effect on the Zen Master.

    What if we traded Lin to the Lakers? As far as what we would get in return... they don't have much to give us, but as a salary dump (assuming we are getting a big FA), he makes sense in LA. Expiring contract leaves their 2015 cap space alone. Secondary ball handler to Kobe, can be primary if Kobe needs to sit a game here and there to rest. He brings in the fans (and the Lakers will need them).

  • Rockets911 says 1 month ago

    blah blah blah..

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    See this is the problem JG. What's Houston's #1 deficiency. Defense. Why not address it and get rid of the #1 guy you can possibly get rid of? JLin, I mean since everyone in Houston is so down on him anyway.

    I mean forget how if Lin plays 30+ min, he averages 16.5ppg, forget that when he does plays 30+ min. Your record is 25-10. That doesn't matter, he's JLin, he sucks right?

    That's just your opinion. It is also just your opinion that Shump is the answer. If he's so great, please, explain why he couldn't see more of the floor last season. Explain why your team was atrocious on defense. Explain why he can't stay healthy. Explain these numbers from 82games.com. The bottom line is you are a one-sided thinker who wants his baby boy to come home. I'll tell you this, if you think Houston fans are harsh, wait until New York fans get a full season of Jeremy. We're saints compared to them. Even Melo talked about it in that same interview you recently linked to.

    By the way, if you just want to troll for Lin arguments then we can end this real quick. You know how this goes. Stop baiting people, please.

    I wonder how much Channing Frye is going to cost. If he can be had at a reasonable price we should definitely take a look at him. After all the other free agents play out of course.

    I agree with this. He is a ways down the list, but Morey won't leave him dangling in the wind if someone else doesn't grab him up. The problem is, Boris Diaw just raised Frye's asking price by at least $1M-$2M.

  • Ostrow says 1 month ago

    I wonder how much Channing Frye is going to cost. If he can be had at a reasonable price we should definitely take a look at him. After all the other free agents play out of course.

  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago

    Ummmm, no thanks. Shump can go to OKC and guard Harden all he wants. He's no better than Sefolosha on D, plus Sefolosha can shoot.

    Beyond the this is a terrible trade for Houston reasons, I don't think it works with the money either. Sorry.

    See this is the problem JG. What's Houston's #1 deficiency. Defense. Why not address it and get rid of the #1 guy you can possibly get rid of? JLin, I mean since everyone in Houston is so down on him anyway.

    I mean forget how if Lin plays 30+ min, he averages 16.5ppg, forget that when he does plays 30+ min. Your record is 25-10. That doesn't matter, he's JLin, he sucks right?
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    Actually as of last season neither can shoot.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Ummmm, no thanks. Shump can go to OKC and guard Harden all he wants. He's no better than Sefolosha on D, plus Sefolosha can shoot.

    Beyond thethis is a terrible trade for Houstonreasons, I don't think it works with the money either. Sorry.

  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago On a possible trade on Draft day...

    Iman Shumpert for JLin and Houston's #1 pick (25)

    Reasons why it works
    Houston's Benefits:
    1. Houston's boosts D, along with PBev that could be sick defensively.
    2. Houston gets rid of Lins contract
    3. Houston really has no use of a 1st rounder other then a trading piece.

    Knicks Benefits:
    1. Knicks #1 priority is getting a PG
    2. Knicks have Shump on the block because they also have Hardaway and JR Smith
    3. Knicks get a 1st rd pick which they are TRYING to get

    So each team fills 2 needs. Houston, Defense and getting rid of Lins contract. Knicks get their PG and #1 pick. Knicks have said they'll take in players and salary but won't extend past 2015 contracts. Lins contract is expiring and they can resign if he works in NY.

    Not to mention it prevents Shump going to OKC so he can guard Harden
    Thoughts?
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    I really don't know what oujoe is arguing for. Well I guess if Portland was amazing, then FAs must be lining up to go there, oh wait they don't. I know every fan loves their city with passion, but Portland is simply not a top tier FA location. Seriously when was the last time they got a major FA? I have also seen blazer fans use the fact that they're the home ofNike AND Adidas, makes them more desirable. Do you realize, it doesn't matter where an athlete lives, as theendorsements go to the athletes, not the athletes to theendorsements. Just a rather desperate attempt to make Portland seem more appealing.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Knickabokkaz

    you remind me of the Laker fans we had here last year. needless to say they left disappointed, which is probably your fate as well. regardless I wish you good luck......after this summer NY will probably need it.

    @oujoe82

    Portland a great city? beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Portland is a very scenic city, but I couldn't live anywhere it rained 300 out of 365 days a year. I have been to Portland many times and I like the city, but make no mistake I wouldn't want to live there. I can't attack a man for loving his city, but in that same breathe don't attack my city. I love it here. there is no better place in America to live IMO. it doesn't matter what % of people are wealthy in your city unless they are mailing checks to your house :lol:Portlanders may earn more, but also suffer with a higher cost of living. we could go back and forth all day with pros and cons for each city, however it really boils down too personal preference. so respect my city and I will respect yours

  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago @jg
    Have to admit, watching Barnani do that live I spit my food out and started cracking up lol
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    I TOLD EVERYONE, Melos a big market player. Nothing like playing for a city like NY! Houston's small time! Https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ec7DAf2EY4

    Knick, I know you like "keepin' it real" so let's do that. Melo is talking out of both sides of his mouth. More importantly, actions speak louder than words. Why opt out if you don't want to go to a smaller market, move your kids, etc.? I seriously doubt his kids will have any trouble making friends if he decides to move. Media is changing and the difference between NY and Houston is not what it used to be....especially when you start to consider the in-roads to China that Houston has established. You want to talk about big markets....New York is a small fish in the global pond...and that's where we operate.

    Irritants like this really ruin this site.

    Unfortunately, we can't solve our problems the way Indiana Jones would....

    tumblr_lt2sibjol01qzz0epo3_500.gif

    ...but when fans from other teams come here to do this....

    tumblr_m2kba8m3U71qfr6udo1_400.gif

    ....all we can do is smile and either engage them or ignore them....

    giphy.gif

    ....and know that this is how it always ends for them....

    tCGdYfT.gif

    Don't get offended because I said Houston is small time compared to NY. It's ok a lot of people hate New Yorkers. I just posted that so you don't give your hopes up because it's very highly unlikely to happen Mr. Buckko. No pun intended.

    You do see what he said about coming from a small market and then playing in NY right? Also the mention of his family moving and his kid having to make new friends. His wife is a Hollywood star. I mean really, what Hollywood star lives in Houston? Beyonće? Oh wait she's married to Jay-Z and he's from Brooklyn just like me and Melo. They go to Brooklyn games and she's from Houston.

    Just saying this whole Melo talk is a waiste of time. Think Lebron is coming? *rolls eyes*. Might get K.Love, or maybe not.

    Hey I'm still rooting for him to go to Houston though! Can't we all just get along? Lin fans and Houston fans should just sing Kumbaya together :) I mean we all want the same thing right? Melo goes to Houston, Lin goes back to NY.

    Hollywood star? Big time Lala Anthony, huh? You do know she's from Piscataway, New Jersey, right? You want to talk small time? That's a town of 56,000. She's a Hollywood star?....if you say so. What stars would live in Houston? How about Lee Majors and Richard Dean Anderson. That's the 6 Million Dollar Man, The Fall Guy, and McGyver. Game, Set, Match. All we need is Jan Michael Vincent from Airwolf and we're set! :lol: Let's not forget the late Patrick Swayze, Dennis Quaid, and a whole bunch of other bad-a$$es like Mark Calaway (aka The Undertaker...who is actually in Austin now), Red Adair, Billy Gibbons (ZZ Topp), Chuck Norris, and Marvin Zindler!...and Matt Bomer for the ladies :wub:

    Perhaps, they're just not tough enough to fit in down here. :P

    By the way, his kid just turned 7. He can make new friends....he'll be going into the 2nd or 3rd grade next year. Not a huge deal.

    You can talk yourself into whatever you want to believe. Technically, any time spent on a fan forum is probably a waste of time so we might as well talk about all the free agents--including Melo. We can agree on one thing--getting J-Lin back to New York would make a lot of people very, very happy. I don't blame you for coming here....I'd visit other fan forums too if I had to be a Knicks fan the last twenty years or so....but especially last year....

    BargnaniAirballdunk.gif

  • uojoe82 says 1 month ago

    Like I said why is that even relevant. FAs don't judge teams by their fans. Lebron went to Miami for Pete's sake. Yes you can say Portland has better fans but then Houston is the FAR better city and the rockets are a much better ran franchise. I'd say that beats any irrelevant argument about fan ranking. Can't believe that is really being argued.

    Houston is the FAR better city? Have you ever been to Portland? As someone who has lived in Portland and visited to Houston (3 times) i can say without a doubt that Portland is a far "cooler" city (with no sales tax). Houston is a concrete jungle. Portland is lush and green and has amazing summers. Who cares that it rains fall, winter, and spring. If you're a professional basketball player you don't care about weather during basketball season.

    Have you ever googled "coolest cities in America"? I assure you that Portland is very high on every list.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/09/cities-to-visit-your-20s_n_4178993.html

    http://images.businessweek.com/slideshows/2012-09-26/americas-50-best-cities#slide47

    Portland # 5, Houston #22

    Portland is a city with culture and full of very smart people. Almost 12% of Portlanders hold graduate degrees (compared to only 6.6 in Houston).

    Average household income is $48k in Houston, in Portland its over $65k (thats almost 36% higher).

    Houston has the fourth worst traffic in the US (http://www.weather.com/activities/driving/slideshow/traffic.html?page=7&scheme=image-horiz-plain.css). Portland isn't even on the list and they have the number 1 public transit system in America.

    Do you like food? Portland consistently ranks as one of the best American cities for food. Ive never seen any Houston restaurants on any lists of best restaurants.

    http://www.bestplaces.net/docs/studies/americas_top_foodie_cities.aspx

    Crime? According to ABC news houston is #6 in cities for violent crimes.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Business/worst-neighborhoods-violent-crime-us/story?id=19087850

    Portland is also the home of Nike AND Adidas.

    So how is Houston FAR better of a city than Portland?

  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago

    Irritants like this really ruin this site.

    Don't get offended because I said Houston is small time compared to NY. It's ok a lot of people hate New Yorkers. I just posted that so you don't give your hopes up because it's very highly unlikely to happen Mr. Buckko. No pun intended.

    You do see what he said about coming from a small market and then playing in NY right? Also the mention of his family moving and his kid having to make new friends. His wife is a Hollywood star. I mean really, what Hollywood star lives in Houston? Beyonće? Oh wait she's married to Jay-Z and he's from Brooklyn just like me and Melo. They go to Brooklyn games and she's from Houston.

    Just saying this whole Melo talk is a waiste of time. Think Lebron is coming? *rolls eyes*. Might get K.Love, or maybe not.

    Hey I'm still rooting for him to go to Houston though! Can't we all just get along? Lin fans and Houston fans should just sing Kumbaya together :) I mean we all want the same thing right? Melo goes to Houston, Lin goes back to NY. 😄
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    I TOLD EVERYONE, Melos a big market player. Nothing like playing for a city like NY! Houston's small time! Https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ec7DAf2EY4

    Irritants like this really ruin this site.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago Like I said why is that even relevant. FAs don't judge teams by their fans. Lebron went to Miami for Pete's sake. Yes you can say Portland has better fans but then Houston is the FAR better city and the rockets are a much better ran franchise. I'd say that beats any irrelevant argument about fan ranking. Can't believe that is really being argued.
  • slick shoes says 1 month ago

    I understand perfectly, Buckko. Since you aren't keen on reading the things that aid in understanding what I am saying, here they are for ya:

    "Door No. 3 (+500 odds): LeBron rolls with Doc and CP3 in Los Angeles — something that would only require the Clippers to trade DeAndre Jordan’s expiring deal, Matt Barnes’s expiring deal and Jamal Crawford’s deal (expires in 2016) to different teams with cap space (super-easy), then use last year’s first round pick (Reggie Bullock) and/or a future first rounder, along with $3 million of Steve Ballmer’s money (chump change!), to dump Jared Dudley (two years, $8.5 million remaining) on someone with cap space (also doable). Chris Paul, Blake Griffin and J.J. Redick will make about $48 million combined next season — if the Clips cleared everyone else (again, VERY doable), they could offer LeBron a deal starting at about $15 million. And he’d get to reinvent himself in Los Angeles, with a coach he loves, a superstar he respects and a billionaire owner who’s ready to splurge on a great team."

    --Bill Simmons

    Trust me, LeBron is more interested in those 3 guys than he is in Terrence Jones, D-Mo, Troy Daniels, and whoever else is on our bench. I get it. We have depth--albeit over-rated by our own fandom--that will appeal to LeBron. However, when you talk about sharing the workload you're talking about the supporting cast of STARS (not role playing bench guys). He's going to leave Miami because Wade is done and Bosh isn't enough to compensate for that.

    Chris Paul and Blake Griffin can both be considered top 10 players and JJ Redick is as good a sharp shooter as you could ask for on the wings, plus he is an under-rated passer, defender, and player in general. Let's not forget Doc Rivers...his presence on the bench matters.

    I think you are way under-rating the Clipper's stars (including the star coach) and way over-rating our "depth". You do remember that to get LeBron we have to dump Lin and Asik and possibly Jones/Motie along with the departure of Garcia, Casspi, Powe, and maybe Hamilton. Sure, a couple of those guys stay, but likely not all. Where's your depth at now?

    After Harden, Beverley, Parsons, James, and Howard who is playing for us? Canaan, Daniels, Jones (if we can keep him), Covington????, Greg Smith comes back????.....only a die hard Rockets fan is excited by that bench. There's plenty of hopeful potential there, but also a ton of inexperience and question marks.

    I'm sure that LeBron would like to be able to take some games off during the season to rest, but he is still going to want to play 36+ minutes a game. I just don't think he is going to look at positional depth as much as he is looking at who is on the floor with me when it's "go time".

    I don't understand why you keep using money as some kind of denying force here. Is it not part of the understanding that he is making choices based on his desire to win and one of those choices is taking less money? That's how I understand it. I'm not sure why you don't. Assuming he is willing to sign in the $15M range, there is hardly a team in the league that couldn't carve out the necessary room for him.

    Ballmer doesnt officially own the team yet. As long as Sterling holds his death grip on the Clips, theyre dead in the water as far as financial decisions go.

  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago I TOLD EVERYONE, Melos a big market player. Nothing like playing for a city like NY! Houston's small time! Https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ec7DAf2EY4
  • majik19 says 1 month ago

    If I were Carmelo, I want to go to a team that has me as their #1 priority and not as a backup plan if Lebron James chooses to stay in Miami, etc.

    I've read that the Bulls are/will be pursuing James as well. I think every team in the Carmelo sweepstakes will take a similar approach - get feelers out for LeBron, and if he even nibbles, go all out at LeBron. If not, all out at Carmelo (while fishing with K-Love trades).

    On a side note - the Bulls, with an even semi-healthy Rose, would be ferocious with LeBron.

  • majik19 says 1 month ago

    If I were Carmelo, I want to go to a team that has me as their #1 priority and not as a backup plan if Lebron James chooses to stay in Miami, etc.

    I've read that the Bulls are/will be pursuing James as well. I think every team in the Carmelo sweepstakes will take a similar approach - get feelers out for LeBron, and if he even nibbles, go all out at LeBron. If not, all out at Carmelo (while fishing with K-Love trades).

    On a side note - the Bulls, with an even semi-healthy Rose, would be ferocious with LeBron.

  • uojoe82 says 1 month ago

    Their fans are better? Lmao. To borrow your words, "Please back this up with figures, otherwise I'm going to dismiss this and all future posts you make."

    https://scholarblogs.emory.edu/esma/nba/best-fans-in-the-nba/

    Portland ranked # 4, Houston ranked #18

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1228462-nba-ranking-the-10-best-fan-bases-in-the-nba

    Portland ranked # 5, Houston not ranked.

    http://dimemag.com/2013/10/10-best-homecourt-advantages-nba/2/

    Portland ranked # 3, Houston not ranked.

    http://www.usatoday.com/videos/sports/nba/2014/05/07/8797619/

    Portland ranked # 5, Houston not ranked,

    http://www.ranker.com/list/nba-teams-with-the-best-crowds/ryanhollins?var=2&utm_expid=16418821-27.IWS5qTkdT1y0VVg72wOjSw.1&utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F

    Portland is #4, Houston is #19.

    Sorry Rocket fans (and timetodienow) but Portland clearly has the better fans. Its not even close.

  • rocketrick says 1 month ago

    3. Yes Portland's coach beat mchale, the better coach won, but if I remember correctly the blazers coach was annihilated by a "better"coach in pop. Considering the coach and SA great fans, why doesn't Lebron just force himself to the spurs? 4. Their core is actually older and lilard doesn't have a huge ceiling. Dwight decline depends on how much he learns from unlimited access to Hakeem. 5. Did I mention no one says "I want to go to the big city. I want to go to Portland." Any other weak arguments?


    For sure it was the Portland Coach that hit that last milli-second 3 point shot that resulted in the Rockets early off-season after the 2014 Playoffs. Oh yeah, Absolutely For Sure.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    Package one of them with Batum and you're there. It's easier than Houston's path, which doesn't even get to max money. Also: they're better than Houston (remember the playoffs?). Their coach is better. Their fans are better. Their games are probably available on local TV to most of their potential audience. Their core is younger. If you're LeBron, you can sign for 4 years and be reasonably sure Aldridge and Lillard will be producing at a high level for all four of those years. You don't get that with Howard.

    I'm mostly just playing devil's advocate because I can't make myself believe Houston has a chance at him.

    1. Batum has a large contract and without assets to dump on a rebuilding team, it will be difficult to trade without taking salary back. 2. "They're better" Lilard 3 rims out, blazers lose in game 7, but it didn't. They were a core that have been together for years, and through the failure of mchale, they won. They were better "last" season. This offseason, this season they are simply the inferior team, talent and depth wise. Just a true statement.
    3. "Their fans are better" Really? I will give rocket fans as about average, but I think after spending 4 years with Miami fans. I don't think the "fandom" is extremely important to lebron, or the viewing audience. (Seriously man, you're putting up some weird arguments) 3. Yes Portland's coach beat mchale, the better coach won, but if I remember correctly the blazers coach was annihilated by a "better"coach in pop. Considering the coach and SA great fans, why doesn't Lebron just force himself to the spurs? 4. Their core is actually older and lilard doesn't have a huge ceiling. Dwight decline depends on how much he learns from unlimited access to Hakeem. 5. Did I mention no one says "I want to go to the big city. I want to go to Portland." Any other weak arguments?
  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Buckko

    Normally FA does have a pecking order, however this is a year where their is more than one alpha dog on the market. so some teams will NOT wait to see what Lebron will do. they will make their move early if they think they have a chance at any of the alpha dogs available.

  • Buckko says 1 month ago A FA goes to the best team, best circumstance, doesn't matter if they weren't their #1 priority. It's a business. Everyone is going to wait until what lebron does, next melo and then the other dominos fall.
  • rocketrick says 1 month ago Is it wise for the Rockets to broadcast that their #1 free agency priority this summer is Lebron James when it's not a fact that he is going to opt out? He doesn't even know today what he's going to do.

    It seems quite clear Carmelo Anthony has already decided as several media reports state sources have confirmed Carmelo is opting out.

    While the Rockets are chasing Lebron James, Carmelo may simply decide to go to Chicago as they seem quite clear at this moment to choose Carmelo as their #1 free agent target regardless.

    If I were Carmelo, I want to go to a team that has me as their #1 priority and not as a backup plan if Lebron James chooses to stay in Miami, etc.

    Of course, nothing can happen until July 1 when those first contacts between teams and free agents are allowed.

    Personally, yes, I would rather have Lebron James than Carmelo Anthony when it comes right down to it. However, I do worry that if not handled carefully, the Rockets could lose out on both and end up with a consolation prize.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    @ Buckko Our current bench is OK, but the bench you cited in your post is definitely a lot greener and weaker!

    @ JG Which of my 2 points would you say is not objectively true?

    1) We got bounced in the 1st round - Fact.

    2) Harden laid an egg in the playoffs - Fact.

    Neither of those is subjective.

    Now I also agree Harden will bounce back (he'd better as we're stuck with him!) - but the point I'm making is that every other playoff team - and some who didn't quite make it - will be making the same arguments on their forum as we're seeing here, and most fans have a higher opinion of their players than everyone else. Better surely to be a bit more cautious than over hopeful on something which is, frankly, a pretty long shot.

    Your comment about who's a Rocket Fan and who isn't is frankly beneath you as the moderator of a fan forum. Always ends in a peeing match.

    Well, I would cite your second "fact" as not objective.

    2) One of our 2 stars absolutely laid an egg in the playoffs when the chips were down. That star also doesn't seem team-focussed, which Lebron totally is, and didn't try on D, which Lebron calls people out for.

    Here is his basketball reference page....and here are the game logs from the playoffs. Now, it would be easy to dismiss him by numbers alone, but that would mean ignoring the fact that Portland chose to shut him down above all else. He was relegated to jacking lots of threes (which didn't fall). Between not getting to the line nearly as much, Portland forcing him into a mid-range/long-range game, and probably just being exhausted from being over played it is no surprise he did not produce the numbers we are accustomed to seeing. You can call it laying an egg if you want, but to call it objective is simply untrue. If you check Harden's game logs from the entire season, I think you will find his performance was not that out of the ordinary.

    He shot 40% or less 31 times (out of 73 games). He shot 50% or less 49 times. Clearly, he is far more likely (nearly 2:1) to have a sub-par game than an above average one. Think about that--only 24 times did he shoot better than 50%. His elite scoring comes at the line and the rim; yet, he got fewer foul calls overall (averaged 1 less/game over the series) while getting his shot blocked twice as much as usual. Portland did a good job against him and, once again, that outside shot just wasn't there.

    Does he need to do better for us to succeed? Sure. Was the problem our offense, or our defense though? We could have gotten past Portland if our defense were better--and I mean as a team--not Just Harden.

    As the moderator of a fan forum, I believe my comment about your fandom is perfectly viable. My previous statement:

    sometimes it is hard to imagine you as a Rockets fan--if we weren't on a Rockets' Fan Forum I'd presume you are not.

    That does not say you are not a fan--simply that your posts make it seem as if you are not. Sorry, but that's the way I see it. I know you are a fan, but if we were in a general NBA forum I'd presume you are not. Sorry for offending you. There is no need for a peeing match. It was just an observation. If you would like to "out-fan" me feel free.

    One last note, and sorry for belaboring the point everybody, but until we know whether these guys are seeking max contracts or not we can't make guesses about what teams can make room. I believe both are inclined to sacrifice some money--how much is up in the air--but I think we will see them take lower salaries next season in order to facilitate a better situation for themselves.

  • Lyfestyle says 1 month ago

    Their fans are better? Lmao. To borrow your words, "Please back this up with figures, otherwise I'm going to dismiss this and all future posts you make."

    I guess you could watch any home Blazers game and compare their crowds to ours. Or go to a regular season game in Houston and wonder, as I do, where the hell everyone is. We had a head coach actually create the Red Rowdies section because of how horrible our fans are. But hey, the reality you live in sounds a lot more fun, I will grant you that.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago Their fans are better? Lmao. To borrow your words, "Please back this up with figures, otherwise I'm going to dismiss this and all future posts you make."
  • Lyfestyle says 1 month ago

    They'd have to unload freeland or wright as well. Look at the salary cap numbers. Of course it's not impossible. But look at portlands location. Not a place players want to be like la/Miami/New York and to a lesser extent Houston.

    Package one of them with Batum and you're there. It's easier than Houston's path, which doesn't even get to max money. Also: they're better than Houston (remember the playoffs?). Their coach is better. Their fans are better. Their games are probably available on local TV to most of their potential audience. Their core is younger. If you're LeBron, you can sign for 4 years and be reasonably sure Aldridge and Lillard will be producing at a high level for all four of those years. You don't get that with Howard.

    I'mmostly just playing devil's advocate because I can't make myself believe Houston has a chance at him.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago They'd have to unload freeland or wright as well. Look at the salary cap numbers. Of course it's not impossible. But look at portlands location. Not a place players want to be like la/Miami/New York and to a lesser extent Houston.
  • Lyfestyle says 1 month ago

    Portland would have to unload far more than Batum, but the team has NO assets to unload many of the said players to get the cap space plus they would have no bench what so ever along with Portland being not a desirable location. It would be a good offensive team, train wreck defensively. However in reality there is only one desirable tier 1, ready made team in the west to insert lebron right in to become absolute championship favorites. Also you said there are 6-8teams in the west yet only two are chasing him because lebron wouldn't even consider them and they know it. When you take in all the factors, it only make sense and even the media agrees that we are the only team who could swindle James from the miami. To compare this to the dwightmare, the clippers are like GS, interesting situation but not really in it. Miami is different from LA due to many factors. Making lebron leaving Miami not nearly as obvious as Dwight leaving and everybody else is Dallas/Atlanta, they can present their case but they're not really in it. As an added note Portland's coach is not any pop so that shouldn't be much of factor.

    Your post is just littered with outright false statements. You start with thestatement that "Portland would have to unload far more than Batum". Please back this up with figures, otherwise I'm going to dismiss this and all future posts you make.

  • Jatman20 says 1 month ago So many responses in this forum and so little time to read them all. I'm sure many post repeat information posted before. Buckko I believe you are correct in your assessment...LeBron can pick any team and that team will make accommodations. Houston offers "No State Tax" along with the other two Texas teams and Florida teams. Houston also offers a core of Harden/D12 ....with Parsons "Bird-Rights" ; which means Houston can get a max player and then re-sign Parsons and go over the Luxary tax (owner willing to take payroll upwards of 88 million-plus).....Not every team offers as much. " A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush." I'm not privileged to discussions between the Rockets and other teams.....I couldn't see Houston dealing Asik or Lin this summer or swapping them for a max guy. Reports by teams say this or say that.....but then nothing happens on occasions.
    Hard for me to believe Charlotte was asked for 3 first-rounders for Asik. I'm one that wanted the so-called reported Lee/Bass deal to take place.....I think Bass could have played Aldridge physical while Lee would have given us 3-point shooting (which is a must to advance in the playoffs). I will say this, the Lakers would have been better off doing a sign and trade with Houston on the D12 situation. New York or Miami should learn from the mistakes of others.
  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago Lol nah I'm a horrible betting man. But to be honest I'm glad Carmelo opted out and Houston gets him. That mostlikely means Lin/Asik/Parsons (yes parsons because without him there's virtually no deal) would head to NY. So I'm praying Houston does get Carmelo.

    We're all rooting for the same thing now!. Lin fans like myself and Houston fans. For the first time! It's going to be interesting to say the least!
  • Buckko says 1 month ago Nickabbokkza, I didn't know you had such a foresight. Can I take you to Vegas my friend?
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    Could LeBron not recreate the Miami dynamic in Portland with Aldridge in Bosh's role and Lillard in Wade's? If Portland traded Batum, they could offer LeBron the max. They also boast a superior coach.

    I think many here, Rahat included, are guilty of acting as though Houston is "clearly" the best option when in reality there are 6-8 teams that would immediately become the championship favorites if LeBron chose them.

    Portland would have to unload far more than Batum, but the team has NO assets to unload many of the said players to get the cap space plus they would have no bench what so ever along with Portland being not a desirable location. It would be a good offensive team, train wreck defensively. However in reality there is only one desirable tier 1, ready made team in the west to insert lebron right in to become absolute championship favorites. Also you said there are 6-8teams in the west yet only two are chasing him because lebron wouldn't even consider them and they know it. When you take in all the factors, it only make sense and even the media agrees that we are the only team who could swindle James from the miami. To compare this to the dwightmare, the clippers are like GS, interesting situation but not really in it. Miami is different from LA due to many factors. Making lebron leaving Miami not nearly as obvious as Dwight leaving and everybody else is Dallas/Atlanta, they can present their case but they're not really in it. As an added note Portland's coach is not any pop so that shouldn't be much of factor.
  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago

    There are pros and cons to Houston. Will Harden take a backseat to James after two years of freedom as the main man?

    .

    If Carmelo or Lebron goes to Houston which I think is highly doubtful for either, Harden will have to take a backseat. If he doesn't like it he might as well ask to be traded because Carmelo will put up 20+ shots atleast no matter what McHale/Harden/D12 says. That's a fact. Parsons might as well ask for a trade as well because he'll be the 4th scoring option and for someone who is playing for a contract and transitioned his game to the offensive end, that doesn't look good for him either.

    There's this strange feeling that there will be no side effects to having just one ball and 4 egos to feed. Egos that want to score the ball. You really aren't considering that to be an extremely realistic problem.

    Parsons to me is irrelevant though because there is no way in hell, Miami or New York does NOT demand to include Parsons in a sign and trade anyway.
  • Lyfestyle says 1 month ago

    Could LeBron not recreate the Miami dynamic in Portland with Aldridge in Bosh's role and Lillard in Wade's? If Portland traded Batum, they could offer LeBron the max. They also boast a superior coach.

    I think many here, Rahat included, are guilty of acting as though Houston is "clearly" the best option when in reality there are 6-8 teams that would immediately become the championship favorites if LeBron chose them.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago We might be close to the forefront, but I don't think Houston is tailor made. Lebron wants to be a SF, not the PF. So he's probably looking at us as having holes at PG and PF. While we have two stars, one has problems on defense. Also will Lebron be able to post up as effectively with Dwight clogging the lane? There are pros and cons to Houston. Will Harden take a backseat to James after two years of freedom as the main man?

    Don't get me wrong. I think we have a great chance. But I'm not blind to the question marks that Houston would have to address to court Lebron.
  • Red94 says 1 month ago New post: Houston Rockets’ Lebron James and Carmelo Anthony Free Agency Watch: Part 2
    By: rahat huq

    • This is actually not Part 2, but you can find all of my thoughts on free agency by clicking on the bottom tag beneath this post.
    • Here's one more thought I've had brewing for some time: I don't think people properly evaluate Lebron James' shelf life and similarly, unless he's completely lacking any sort of cognizance of his basketball mortality (which is very well possible, as is the case with many of the greats), I don't think the appropriate sense of urgency is ascribed to his mindset.  James is 29 already, has been playing since he was 18, but also carrying crappy teams deep into the playoffs by himself since a young age.  We deify Jordan, which is great for narrative, but we casually omit recognition of some very accommodating factors he had in his favor, namely that he didn't come into the league until later and above all, that he took a nearly two-year break from the game.  Too often, people make the mistake of assessing a player's shelf life by his age, rather than by his odometer.  James is already 29 and only has two championships by his name.  To even tie Michael, at a best-case scenario, he'd need to maintain dominance until age 33 with his team achieving the unlikely feat of winning four straight championships.  That's not happening and that God-like athleticism is already slightly beginning to deteriorate.  The aforementioned is why I don't quite understand the rationale when it is often brought up that James "can just opt in with the Heat for this next year, then survey the landscape again in 2015."  I really don't get that.  Are we really not grasping that the Heat won't be winning the title ever again?  There were several West teams that would have beaten them in a series and Kyle Lowry alone isn't changing that.  By the end of the Finals, Miami looked even worse than James' old Cavs teams with James and Bosh left standing as the only competent players.  Again, I go back to the bell-curve I discussed for financial motivations: it applies here too.  The vast majority of players would be beyond thrilled with a scenario that guaranteed an annual trip to the Finals.  (At the bottom curve, players are just happy to be in the NBA, even if its in Milwaukee).  But for James, being competitive isn't enough - he has to win titles, and quickly.  He's running out of time. So again, I don't quite get this notion that James can just "wait it out until 2015" and should "trust Pat Riley to fix it."  Why even wait for something to be fixed when there is a tailor-made situation in Houston?
  • Buckko says 1 month ago Asik can be their center of the future which they have been looking for.
  • Cooper says 1 month ago Depends on how much the C's are rebuilding, if rondo is the same guy, they could pull off a 4-5 seed playoff team with asik and another free agent wing or something plus whoever their high pick is. Along with having flexibility to bring in another star.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago A rebuilding team does not take on tons of salary while simultaneously giving up a draft choice. lol .
  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    CARMELO ANTHONY WILL BE A HOUSTON ROCKET BY JULY 10

    so let it be said, so let it be written, so let it be DONE

  • Buckko says 1 month ago Best case scenario though, a bit if a pipe dream though. Instead of a future 1st, asik is traded for the 17th from the C's to draft and stash Caplie then dump the 25th and Lin on the lakers,76ers, or Jazz.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago Rahat, you have to stop worrying about the cost of Lin. Dumping him and the rights to the 25th pick will be fine. 1st rounders are expensive under the current CBA and especially in this deep class are easily worth paying Lin for one year. Lin is not Gerald Wallace bad, he's a decent player who can put fans in the seats and sell merchandise while opening up the Asian market which would ease the cost of the poison pill contract. Plus the rockets have to unload the 25th anyway to make room for lebron anyway. With reports of Morey already having deals ready, I bet it's one those situations where the other team tells the rockets which player to pick in the draft so they can trade them the rights later. Then I bet asik is going to Boston for a future 1st.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago Well you can discuss other teams, but none other are in a position to give a lebron a better team than the rockets, not overrating, just based on overall talent. Now if he decides not to go to houston over any other personal reason, then it's by him. However the media agrees Houston offers the best team available but can that overcome Lebron's ties to the heat is the question.
  • Journeymany says 1 month ago

    @ Buckko Our current bench is OK, but the bench you cited in your post is definitely a lot greener and weaker!

    @ JG Which of my 2 points would you say is not objectively true?

    1) We got bounced in the 1st round - Fact.

    2) Harden laid an egg in the playoffs - Fact.

    Neither of those is subjective.

    Now I also agree Harden will bounce back (he'd better as we're stuck with him!) - but the point I'm making is that every other playoff team - and some who didn't quite make it - will be making the same arguments on their forum as we're seeing here, and most fans have a higher opinion of their players than everyone else. Better surely to be a bit more cautious than over hopeful on something which is, frankly, a pretty long shot.

    Your comment about who's a Rocket Fan and who isn't is frankly beneath you as the moderator of a fan forum. Always ends in a peeing match.

  • Cooper says 1 month ago Melo ain't taking a pay cut to throw two seasons away with the Knicks. He might very well stay but it will be for the 5 year max.
  • Knickabokkaz_2 says 1 month ago

    Here we go again.

    Well it seems like a lock that Carmelo will opt out BUT the vast opinion in NY, from Carmelo's camp according to 98.7FM in NY (ESPN New York) is that he's going to opt out but WILL resign back with the Knicks. As much as I listen to sports radio in NY which is way too much, I've heard this on multiple outlets as well. Phil will NOT pay Carmelo the max deal of $129 million, but then again Phil doesn't have to, and is using the quote from Melo against him. Carmelo has mentioned numerous times in interviews in the NY media outlets that "I'll be the first one to take a paycut to help build our team". The misconception to that, is that other fans such as Houston, or Chicago, think that "paycut" pertains to them. Carmelo if anything, loves NY, was born and raised 10 minutes from me in Redhook Brooklyn. He's a "bright lights" type of player. Hometown kid, so he's going to give that hometown discount if it came to that ... to NEW YORK. The ONLY reason for him opting out is because he wants to just see his worth. What teams would offer. He wants to be flattered by obscene offers and what teams would give up to get him.

    Everyone knows I want JLin off this team, I want him back in NY, and I'm not going to flinch to admit it... but it's done as far as the chances of him getting back to NY in a sign and trade with Carmelo because Carmelo is not going anywhere. He's staying in NY. He's already had a meeting with Phil and Derek Fisher. Carmelo, when asked what he thought about Fisher being hired as Knicks’ head coach, said, “I like what Phil is doing.” Does anyone really think the writing's not on the wall already and this is just a smoke screen, or something to just write about? Meanwhile Phil is in Turkey getting married right now with not a thing to worry about.

    Don't be surprised if Melo has a change of heart and just decides to opt in on Monday which is when he's expected to make his decision, as Phil has suggested Carmelo should do. See what it's like playing for Phil and Derek Fisher, playing in the Triangle offense which he would thrive in I think. Then next year when Amare is off the books, Tyson Chandler, Bargnani, JR Smith... everything is wide open as far as the Knicks having maximum cap space to bring in just about anyone. Either way, plain and simple. Carmelo Anthony will be a Knick next year.

  • Red94 says 1 month ago New post: Houston Rockets' Lebron James and Carmelo Anthony Free Agency Watch: Part 1
    By: rahat huq

    • I realize that this isn't Part 1 of this topic, but what the hell else do you expect me to title this thing?  I thought I had a pretty good thing going with my "On the Houston Rockets' pursuit of Carmelo Anthony: Part X", but that kind of went down in flames when all of this Lebron stuff hit the fan considering that the maneuvering to acquire either player will be intertwined and related.  So we're going to have just one big running series until either one of these guys signs or we get left out in the cold signing neither and starting the season with both Jeremy Lin and Omer Asik in the most anticlimactic endpoint since...the Houston Rockets' 2013-2014 season.
    • Speaking of series', you can relive the euphoria of last summer by glancing back over my Dwight Howard Free Agency Watch series, where, over like a month, I go from daring to believe we have a chance to outright cardiac arrest upon the day of the signing.  Relive the day of the decision here, maybe one of my favorite posts in the history of Red94 and simultaneously one of the best/worst days of my life.  More on this.
    • Our buddies over at The Dream Shake noted on Twitter, earlier in the week, that there's a certain collective confidence that Daryl Morey gets this thing done and brings someone in.  I dared before not write that in print, but here it is: I think it happens.  I think Houston reels in either Anthony or James, most likely Anthony.  Such is the way of those following a team that has made the biggest splash of each summer.  I did not feel this way at all last summer.  I felt that looking at things logically, Houston made the most sense for Howard.  But I dared not believe that NBA decisions could ever be fueled by logic.  Logic and rationality is the ugly stepsister of ethos/pathos and "count the rings; 16 to 2 bitches; the Lakers are a storied franchise that will always build it back up because they always do"...
    • I said at the time that the Sam Amick tweet last summer disclosing Howard's decision was the most significant moment in sports social media history considering that the Twitter era has only really been like two or three years long and, unbelievably, one that doesn't even span back to Lebron James' "Decision."  We had Twitter, but it wasn't ubiquitous, as it is now.  Which leads me to my point: if James' decision this year is disclosed by a Tweet, it will be the most re-tweeted Tweet thus far in the history of Twitter.  Well, maybe not.  But in the history of sports Twitter.  If both Anthony and James reach their decisions on the same day, with dramatic decisions like both players leaving to new teams, there is strong potential for the internet shutting down entirely.
    • If Michael's "I'm back" fax to the Bulls were broken in Tweet form, that vs. "Sources tell Y! Sports that Lebron James has chosen to sign four year max contract with Houston Rockets."  (I just wanted to see what that looked like.)
    • Sam Amick is reporting that the Rockets already have deals lined up to jettison Omer Asik and Jeremy Lin in the event a commitment from either Carmelo Anthony or Lebron James surfaces.  As I've been saying, I'm extremely curious to see what the going price for Jeremy Lin ends up being.  You can probably get a mid first round pick for Asik.  But then are you going to have to include that pick, along with your own, to unload Lin?  Two first rounders should be enough to dump one year of Lin, no matter how poorly he's played of recent date.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago As far as your statement of having one of the worst bench's in the nba. The rockets had the 5th best bench this past season, but were played the 3rd least. I'm not worried about harden, he's young and just hit a mental road block. It's like all the people who blame him for not showing up in the 2012 finals. If it weren't for harden against SA in the conference finals, they wouldn't be there in the first place. Ok I can agree with you on the money JG.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    @Buckko--I'm pretty sure Simmons did. Here is LA's salary page. It doesn't matter. You're hell-bent on the Rockets being head and shoulders above the rest. According to you, we can build an amazing roster around LeBron, but nobody else can--despite having roughly the same constraints.

    You continue to cite money as some sort of deciding factor in order to steer LeBron to us. You've got to get some reality and perspective here. This is how his money looks: FORBES. Since you don't seem to click links I post, that would be $19.3M from basketball and $53M from endorsements this year alone. This does not include the money he makes on side deals, like the $30M he made recently in his partnership with Dre and Beats Audio. So, if you think LeBron is worried about the difference between a $21M contract and a $15M contract and the 10% income tax...well, you're entitled to that opinion, but I seriously doubt he is. The dude made $103M last year--that we know of. Currently, his net worth sits around $250M.

    If he wants to play for free--he can. Money is not an issue here except for the salary cap.

    Look, we're in the running for him--I agree. I just don't think it is as clear cut as you do. I think lots of teams are potentially in this.

    @Journeymany--sometimes it is hard to imagine you as a Rockets fan--if we weren't on a Rockets' Fan Forum I'd presume you are not. As for agreeing with me, I doubt that is true. You might think we agree, but based on your perspectives and statements I am doubtful we agree on anything. My favorite part of your post is the casual use of the word, "objectively".

    tumblr_m81efoicir1r927dro1_500-gif.jpg

    I'd make some counter-points, but it wouldn't do much good. I will say, no, all 7 other playoff teams do not look better than us.

  • Journeymany says 1 month ago

    Well there's a paycut and then theres a massive pay cut with 10%+ income tax. Plus Simmons is pretty terrible at the CBA. He didn't take account for the 12 player cap holds which would significantly cut into any cap space they wish to use on lebron assuming they get rid of everyone except reddick, blake, and CP. Not to mention losing their main defender and rim protector in DJ makes LA look a lot less appealing. Now to discuss Houston's depth. We always talk about how jones dominates scrubs and fails against real competition. Playing against 2nd units, he would dominate every night while Dmo has shown great promise and with full back up minutes, I'm expecting a good year. While the rest of the guys are young, they're dead eye shooters. The two FAs that would be fantastic for the rockets to pick up IMO is Danny Granger and Elton Brand. Making your lineup Beverley-harden-parsons-lebron-Howard with a bench of Cannan-Daniels-Covington-jones-Dmo and brand/granger filling out your 12 man roster with the injury reserve the 42nd pick and either D-leaguer signies or other low class FAs. Other FAs the rockets could go after is ransacking the heat's roster for birdman and Reshad Lewis or going after Caron Butler. The rockets also have a couple decent Euro stashes they can bring over any time and all their future picks plus some more.That's some pretty good depth right there with the ability to add plenty more as lebron ages. Have you seen the clippers draft considerations? A bit barren. Not trying to sound like a dumb homer, just trying to state logical reasons. Plus who else can offer preminium Dream access.

    That bench has got to be one of, if not the worst in the NBA - have to say I'm with JG on this one. Also, why does everyone think Lebron will look at us and think we're where it's at? Objectively:

    1) We got bounced in the 1st round.

    2) One of our 2 stars absolutely laid an egg in the playoffs when the chips were down. That star also doesn't seem team-focussed, which Lebron totally is, and didn't try on D, which Lebron calls people out for.

    When you remember those facts, don't the other 7 playoff teams look a lot better? Or rolling through the East playoffs with whoever you please?

  • miketheodio says 1 month ago

    2:05 - 3:05

    for what it's worth on hollins

    who knows

  • Buckko says 1 month ago Depending on the matchups, move Dmo to starting PF because we can all agree he made a great leap defensively this year and still stretch the floor while lebron moves to SF and rotate parsons off the bench, but that might be too much to ask of Mchale.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago Why is nobody discussing that Lebron has repeatedly stated that he doesn't want to be a PF. He hates guarding guys like David west. That makes going to a team like Houston where he'll be the PF look not as appealing.

    At least that's what I remember from the Indy series. He likes to roam on the perimeter playing help defense and picking off passing lanes.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago Well there's a paycut and then theres a massive pay cut with 10%+ income tax. Plus Simmons is pretty terrible at the CBA. He didn't take account for the 12 player cap holds which would significantly cut into any cap space they wish to use on lebron assuming they get rid of everyone except reddick, blake, and CP. Not to mention losing their main defender and rim protector in DJ makes LA look a lot less appealing. Now to discuss Houston's depth. We always talk about how jones dominates scrubs and fails against real competition. Playing against 2nd units, he would dominate every night while Dmo has shown great promise and with full back up minutes, I'm expecting a good year. While the rest of the guys are young, they're dead eye shooters. The two FAs that would be fantastic for the rockets to pick up IMO is Danny Granger and Elton Brand. Making your lineup Beverley-harden-parsons-lebron-Howard with a bench of Cannan-Daniels-Covington-jones-Dmo and brand/granger filling out your 12 man roster with the injury reserve the 42nd pick and either D-leaguer signies or other low class FAs. Other FAs the rockets could go after is ransacking the heat's roster for birdman and Reshad Lewis or going after Caron Butler. The rockets also have a couple decent Euro stashes they can bring over any time and all their future picks plus some more.That's some pretty good depth right there with the ability to add plenty more as lebron ages. Have you seen the clippers draft considerations? A bit barren. Not trying to sound like a dumb homer, just trying to state logical reasons. Plus who else can offer preminium Dream access.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    The clippers would have to go through some serious rings of fire to open cap space for lebron and he would still have to take a significant paycut(12 player cap holds add up) with California's serious income tax. I mention the gutted roster because Lebron is being ran into the ground approaching 30 and he's just worn out. That's why I mention that a stacked bench with youth and position to continue adding more would be very desirable for him. With the money and the clippers having zero other players to back him up. I just don't see it. Amazing as rocket fans we've come this far.

    I understand perfectly, Buckko. Since you aren't keen on reading the things that aid in understanding what I am saying, here they are for ya:

    "Door No. 3 (+500 odds): LeBron rolls with Doc and CP3 in Los Angeles — something that would only require the Clippers to trade DeAndre Jordan’s expiring deal, Matt Barnes’s expiring deal and Jamal Crawford’s deal (expires in 2016) to different teams with cap space (super-easy), then use last year’s first round pick (Reggie Bullock) and/or a future first rounder, along with $3 million of Steve Ballmer’s money (chump change!), to dump Jared Dudley (two years, $8.5 million remaining) on someone with cap space (also doable). Chris Paul, Blake Griffin and J.J. Redick will make about $48 million combined next season — if the Clips cleared everyone else (again, VERY doable), they could offer LeBron a deal starting at about $15 million. And he’d get to reinvent himself in Los Angeles, with a coach he loves, a superstar he respects and a billionaire owner who’s ready to splurge on a great team."

    --Bill Simmons

    Trust me, LeBron is more interested in those 3 guys than he is in Terrence Jones, D-Mo, Troy Daniels, and whoever else is on our bench. I get it. We have depth--albeit over-rated by our own fandom--that will appeal to LeBron. However, when you talk about sharing the workload you're talking about the supporting cast of STARS (not role playing bench guys). He's going to leave Miami because Wade is done and Bosh isn't enough to compensate for that.

    Chris Paul and Blake Griffin can both be considered top 10 players and JJ Redick is as good a sharp shooter as you could ask for on the wings, plus he is an under-rated passer, defender, and player in general. Let's not forget Doc Rivers...his presence on the bench matters.

    I think you are way under-rating the Clipper's stars (including the star coach) and way over-rating our "depth". You do remember that to get LeBron we have to dump Lin and Asik and possibly Jones/Motie along with the departure of Garcia, Casspi, Powe, and maybe Hamilton. Sure, a couple of those guys stay, but likely not all. Where's your depth at now?

    After Harden, Beverley, Parsons, James, and Howard who is playing for us? Canaan, Daniels, Jones (if we can keep him), Covington????, Greg Smith comes back????.....only a die hard Rockets fan is excited by that bench. There's plenty of hopeful potential there, but also a ton of inexperience and question marks.

    I'm sure that LeBron would like to be able to take some games off during the season to rest, but he is still going to want to play 36+ minutes a game. I just don't think he is going to look at positional depth as much as he is looking at who is on the floor with me when it's "go time".

    I don't understand why you keep using money as some kind of denying force here. Is it not part of the understanding that he is making choices based on his desire to win and one of those choices is taking less money? That's how I understand it. I'm not sure why you don't. Assuming he is willing to sign in the $15M range, there is hardly a team in the league that couldn't carve out the necessary room for him.

  • Cooper says 1 month ago Ballmer just payed 2bill for the team I doubt he'd not spend to add some guys to the bench, plus veteran players respect CP and lebron they wouldn't have much trouble finding 4-5 solid guys.
    Plus they would likely get a pick or two for DJ and Crawford to add young talent moving forward.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago The clippers would have to go through some serious rings of fire to open cap space for lebron and he would still have to take a significant paycut(12 player cap holds add up) with California's serious income tax. I mention the gutted roster because Lebron is being ran into the ground approaching 30 and he's just worn out. That's why I mention that a stacked bench with youth and position to continue adding more would be very desirable for him. With the money and the clippers having zero other players to back him up. I just don't see it. Amazing as rocket fans we've come this far.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Yeah, that was one giant rambling mess....

    My original post addressed all of this. It's all contingent on pay cuts. I was crystal clear about this.

    First, Melo only re-signs with the Knicks if Lala makes him do it. They had to hire Phil Jackson to fix that mess because he is the only person patient enough to see it through (and $12M per year doesn't hurt either). This article/interview with Jackson hits the nail on the head regarding the Knicks, Melo, and Jackson's stance on it. LINK

    Nobody is going to the Bulls. I don't even know why people still think that is realistic. Until Derrick Rose plays an entire season of basketball (and looks good doing it) they will not get a player to tie their career to his. That's it. End of story. I don't care about Thibs, Noah, Butler, Chicago's great city life, or Mike Ditka. They are out of all discussions. D.Rose is one injury away from Brandon Roy status.

    I also mentioned that Bill Simmons went into detail about the Clipper's ability to sign LBJ--and yes, Paul, Redick, James, and Griffin can beat OKC/San Antonio with any mediocre center they can find.

    Your argument that LBJ and a couple other stars with a gutted roster can't win is destroyed by remembering he did exactly that 2 of the last three seasons. (Oh, and he did it against your two "unbeatable" teams: SA and OKC)

    I don't compare LBJ and Melo for one very good reason--they are no where near the same. GM's don't get warm and fuzzy the same way they do when Melo's name comes up versus LeBron's. As a GM, when you get LeBron you are immediately thinking about championship banners. When you get Melo, you are immediately thinking, "Geez, I hope I don't regret this?"

    Both talents are undeniable, but only one has proven he can do anything with it.

    I also think I was very clear that Houston was definitely a front runner for LBJ because of what we could offer.

    Here's the video from Parsons....for those who care

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Hi, I'm Josh McRoberts and the Bobcats like me. They aren't trading for Asik to replace me--that makes very little sense. It's not aboutmaking the trade work with details it's a simple matter of realizing I'M THEIR GUY.

    54723896-1f7b-4150-95d6-0392596a328f.jpg

    Also, you can catch me onIt's Always Sunny in Philadelphia on FXX playing this character--

    charlie.png

  • Buckko says 1 month ago Unless lebron and melo took ungodly paycuts that wouldn't work. Plus the public outrage would be pretty bad, harden resurrected houston basketball and trading harden for melo severely limits your title window. I disagree with you entirely thejohhnygold, why even give melo discussion a chance when he can simply go to the bulls or resign with the nicks? Sure Houston would be a better destination than both Miami and NYC/Chicago in terms of team talent, but by that logic why cut down discussion on lebron and not melo? All those teams you listed, theoretically could be title contenders with lebron that you listed, but either they have to completly gut their teams to afford the cap to get him and might be title contenders but not title winners or favorites, making said destination undesirable including the clippers who would either have to trade blake or Their entire supporting class and DJ. Do you think any if those gutted teams with lebron could stop the thunder or spurs. Now use logical reasoning, you can carry a team of guys on the wrong side of 35, a no show, and a crippled to the finals just to be smashed by a far superior team or join the most dominant center in the last 6 years along with the best SF and top 3 offensive superstar and the deepest bench he has ever known. It's still warm, still a big city, no income tax either. How many years of prime of prime do you have left when approaching 30? I think by default houston fans are pessimists, but they need to understand we are in a very likable destination with desirable circumstances. As an added note, I think Morey and Parsons have a back room where they do all their scheming and back scratching, because what was the first thing chandler said on Lebron on SportsNation and started the snowball rolling was he's going to be in a different jersey next year. Now he did not indicate the rockets because it goes from a sublimal message to an obvious recruitment attempt which defeats the purpose. However I think it was with purpose as in the past we have seen Parson's recruitment skills and his intelligence. Sorry for lack of organization, mobile limits that.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago Jefferson has range out to 18 feet. I'm curious as to how much MKG can improve his shot this next year. He still has superstar potential if he get a decent jumper.
  • Cooper says 1 month ago

    Could the bobcats play with 3 guys that just can't shoot at all in Asik big Al and MKG? that puts a lot of pressure on Walker to get everyone shots.

  • Freebird says 1 month ago

    I know it's rough around the edges, and there is a lot of the little pieces that I know I'm forgetting. I think they had Biyombo moving, as well.

    I even without the picks and fillers, I thought enough of it to think that it wouldn't be a terrible thing. Everyone kinda gets something they want, which is typically enough for something to get done. I'll let the GMs sort out the nitty gritty details.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Yeah, those fans can talk all they want. The Bobcats really like McRoberts at PF and that is a lot to give up for Asik.

    Also, the Knicks like their young SG's--why pick up Henderson?

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago I don't want to sound mean, but that is laughable. Take out the no. 9 pick and it's some what plausible. The bobcats might like Asik, but not for a lotto pick.
  • Freebird says 1 month ago

    Being out here in Bobcat land, most of the guys I talk ball with are Charlotte fans. This has been an ongoing topic for us - a 3-way between HOU, NYK, and CHA. Basics:

    HOU gets Melo

    CHA gets Asik

    NYK gets Lin, Henderson, and the no. 9, 24, and 25 picks.

    Very basic, I know, and lots of variations abound. Prolly a few filler pieces. But these guys would be ecstatic to put Asik on the line with Jefferson. Best part is that even the basics actually work in the trade machine(s) - even before the picks/sweeteners.

    And honestly, even with all the LBJ talk, if this deal is on the table, I think we take it. Waiting to see can be a bad thing here. LBJ in house would be fantastic, but Melo in house would be dang near as good, due to our system.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago What if we offered harden to the Cavs for the no. 1 pick, traded away Lin/Asik/jones to clear cap space and then signed Melo and James. A starting five of

    Beverley
    Wiggins
    Melo
    Lebron
    Howard

    All are two way players(assuming Parsons gets back to work on that end). We'd have to fill out the rest with parsons, Canaan, Dmo, and cheap vets. I just don't see a better starting core that would be built for years.

    I love harden but Lebron is Lebron.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    New Orleans capped themselves out with Reke and Holdiay, who are suddenly close to untradeable along with Gordon who is untradeable until he's an expiring contract.but you're right adding lebron to any of the west playoff teams or phx and they're a legit title contender even a couple east teams like Chicago, the wiz or raps would be really good.
    The main thing I would guess that keeps Lebron in either Miami or Cleveland is he looks like a big time sellout if he goes to us or the clips, even GS. Howard got to the point where he realized public perception didnt really matter to him as long as he was winning and happy not sure if lebron is there plus he'd be putting Wade in a tough spot leaving him on a borderline playoff team in Miami if they really are that good of friends that could be a problem but who knows perhaps he's realized there's gonna be someone to criticize him no matter what happens and maybe wade woudlnt mind following him on a MLE deal and play 20min a game Like Ginobli which would open up just about any option he wants.

    New Orleans could easily clear the necessary space for LBJ. They are at $48M (before cap holds) and could clear $11M in the blink of an eye by not picking up team options for Luke Babbit and Austin Rivers and by putting Ryan Anderson on the trade block. That gets them to $37M committed salary and they still have Holiday, Gordon, Evans, and Anthony.

    Remember, a big part of this exercise is the notion that LBJ wants rings above all else....this means he is willing to sign for less than the max and conceivably in the $14-15M range...maybe even less. I think a lot of doors are wide open right now. He's got 3-4 more years of potential dominance....if he is set on getting 2-3 more rings he can't waste them.

    If I were him I'd be looking at the Clippers, Rockets, Warriors, and the Wizards.

  • Cooper says 1 month ago New Orleans capped themselves out with Reke and Holdiay, who are suddenly close to untradeable along with Gordon who is untradeable until he's an expiring contract.but you're right adding lebron to any of the west playoff teams or phx and they're a legit title contender even a couple east teams like Chicago, the wiz or raps would be really good.
    The main thing I would guess that keeps Lebron in either Miami or Cleveland is he looks like a big time sellout if he goes to us or the clips, even GS. Howard got to the point where he realized public perception didnt really matter to him as long as he was winning and happy not sure if lebron is there plus he'd be putting Wade in a tough spot leaving him on a borderline playoff team in Miami if they really are that good of friends that could be a problem but who knows perhaps he's realized there's gonna be someone to criticize him no matter what happens and maybe wade woudlnt mind following him on a MLE deal and play 20min a game Like Ginobli which would open up just about any option he wants.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    I don't honestly think LBJ will come. Yes, James+D12+Beard is better than Miami's big 3.

    But how do we sign him. Will Leslie pay luxury tax? Micky didn't want to pay too much more tax and that was the reason Heat lost, they had very thin bench.

    Our owner is very cheap. Look at his track record, he had no interest in luxury tax.

    http://www.shamsports.com/2013/07/complete-history-of-luxury-tax-payments.html

    Well, looks like I'm first on site to correct this. Les has been saying for a long while now that he is more than happy to go into the tax for acontending team. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that signing Lebron qualifies for this.

    That chart is funny and enlightening.

    James' decision does not exist in a vacuum. He is not a deity that can bring forth into existence any reality he desires. If he does seek a new team in order to chase the glory of championships and strengthen his legacy's resume I do believe there are quite a few teams in contention for his services that are as valid as Houston.

    Golden State, with their two young guards and Iguodala have to be appealing. At that point, a stout, defensive center of any kind and you are in business.

    The Clippers (Bill Simmons explained this one in his most recent article) could put together a squad of Paul, Redick, James, and Griffin (again needing any kind of center to complete the package.

    Phoenix finds itself in a similar situation with 2 excellent guards to tempt James with.

    Houston....Houston has the trump card. No team can offer James what he has never had (no, Big Z and Shaq don't count)....a legitimate center to play with (well, Memphis and Chicago can). Above all things, this is what I think gives Houston an edge. Surely, James has to fantasize about what that must be like. Look, Harden's great and all, but does he move the needle more than a Chris Paul or Steph Curry? I say no.

    The bottom line is LeBron James could go to Memphis, Portland, Minnesota, and countless other teams with talent and immediately make them contenders. I mean really, a front court of James, Love, and Pekovic plus Martin's outside shooting and Rubio (or maybe they can trade him for somebody who can shoot) is dangerous.

    Portland-Lillard, Matthews, James, Aldridge, Lopez--egads! These owners are all wealthy and I seriously doubt even notoriously cheap Jerry Reinsdorf doesn't open his wallet for LeBron James. There is not a team in the NBA that isn't at least taking a moment to look at this possibility--yes, even Milwaukee.

    Why is New Orleans not an option? They've got cap room, new ownership that would love to start off with 2 home runs (Anthony Davis AND LeBron!!! Yes, please), and guys like Tyreke Evans, Anthony Morrow, Brian Roberts, Eric Gordon's knowledge of the training room, and Jrue Holiday.....C'mon, you're going to tell me that team can't make waves and be a serious contender with LBJ on board?

    If we operate under the assumption that LBJ is all about the rings and every owner would find a way to make it happen then there are lots of teams in play here. Heck, Memphis would be quite a sight....Gasol, Randolph and James plus Courtney Lee, Tony Allen, Conley, Mike Miller, et al....Wow.

    The only team that is 100% not in the running? LA Lakers. :lol: :lol: :lol:

  • dbd says 1 month ago

    I don't honestly think LBJ will come. Yes, James+D12+Beard is better than Miami's big 3.

    But how do we sign him. Will Leslie pay luxury tax? Micky didn't want to pay too much more tax and that was the reason Heat lost, they had very thin bench.

    Our owner is very cheap. Look at his track record, he had no interest in luxury tax.

    http://www.shamsports.com/2013/07/complete-history-of-luxury-tax-payments.html

  • Red94 says 1 month ago New post: More on Lebron to Houston, Hollins
    By: rahat huq

    • I've been writing about Lebron James now since last week, and the unlikely scenario which would bring him to the Rockets.  I've decided to continue this crusade until Houston is dismissed outright by The King.  Because...why not?  Why is mere discussion of the topic deemed so outlandish?  How is it any more of a long shot than Chris Bosh was a few years back?  He probably won't come, but just because he is on path to end up the greatest player of all time doesn't make the discussion of his pursuit any more meritless.  
    • Inception is a beautiful concept isn't it?  We're now seeing more and more mentions, over the past few days, of Houston's intent on pursuing James.  A tweet from Bill Simmons, several mentions from Yahoo's Adrian Wojnarowski on various medians, and then the Sam Amick USAToday piece which read more like a Rockets sales pitch than a news story.  Houston doesn't need the whole world to know they want James.  They will approach him on their own and through the back channels only power players in this industry can navigate. But the media game has purpose.  Get everyone talking and you can plant a seed.  Perception often truly is reality.  Wheels start turning.  If enough people, or the right people, become convinced of the plausibility, it becomes plausible.  And ultimately, if you exude confidence from the get-go, you aren't as likely to be seen as a long-shot and intrigue is built.  "Why do they think I'd want to go there...there must be something."  This principle probably works with women as well.

    • As I ranted on Twitter, on Tuesday, for almost an hour, in a diatribe which spanned tens of strings of 140-characters, why is Houston seen as such a longshot?  I get that it's unlikely he leaves at all, and thus, by extension, any other team is considered a longshot, but that doesn't seem to be the tone surrounding Houston.  Rather, the dismissal is intrinsic upon the desirability of Houston itself rather than upon the unlikelihood of James' departure.  But the Clippers are considered a possibility?  I don't think I get it.  If James came, the team would immediately be considered the favorite to win not just next year's title, but the next few after that until Dwight Howard broke down.  They'd boast a lineup of Patrick Beverley, James Harden, Dwight Howard, Chandler Parsons, and Lebron James with a bench featuring whatever diamond Daryl Morey unearths for 2015.  That is, bar none, the best lineup in basketball.  But Houston's a laughable possibility?  Man, the rest of the country must really think this place is a complete dump.
    • I think you could begin to make the argument that the triumvirate of Harden, Howard, and James is superior to the one of Bosh, Wade, and James four years ago.  Four summers ago, everyone was soiling the bed over the latter prospect.  But nothing of the potential Rocket trio?  And as for the comparison today, it's not even close, with how hard Dwyane Wade has fallen off the map.  James Harden is a workhorse who can carry a team into the West playoffs on his own; Wade can't even suit up for more than 60% of his team's games.
    • Another thing: it's always thrown out that James "trusts Pat Riley to fix things."  Why does Lebron even need to wait or have trust when he can just come to Houston and a ready-made situation?  It's like if a woman has some handsome, kind and caring anesthesiologist ready to marry her, but everyone thinks she'll stay with her abusive boyfriend--who happens to work at Waffle House--because she trusts the latter can fix things.  (Okay, not exactly the best analogy.  I get that emotions are involved here and in such a case, it's hard to just pick up and leave someone and start a new....which leads to the next bullet...)
    • Are emotions involved?  Is Lebron thinking, "man, I can't just screw over D Wade and leave" or "man, I'd hate to find a new place to live" or "man, everyone is really going to hate me even more if I leave yet again."  I really don't think so.  This is someone who I think has resolved any doubts about whether he gives two cents about what any of us think.  And you know what?  He was right.  Had James "done the right thing" and stayed in Cleveland "like Michael would have", he'd still be The Ringless King or whatever idiotic memes the internet would have come up with.  Instead, he has two titles and no one criticizes his decision.
    • It comes down to two things, really: the East and the city.  Lebron is no doubt aware he has a free pass to the Finals every year that he stays in the East.  Indiana, the lone threat of this past year, might not even be together next season.  And while I've never been to Miami, it apparently is one hell of a place to live.
    • Finally, of perhaps just as much significance, Marc Spears reported earlier in the week that Houston holds interest in Lionel Hollins to fill the role of "associate head coach."  First, I'm not entirely sure what the hell an "associate head coach" is, but if its anything like a defensive coordinator, sign me up.  I've been vocal about the Rockets' need for improved coaching, particularly on the defensive end, so this news comes as extremely comforting.  It signifies that 1) the team is aware and in agreeance about the problem.  That's huge.  But moreover, Hollins openly expressed disagreement with analytical principles during his tenure in Memphis, even clashing with front office heads.  One might surmise that perhaps the Rockets are changing their thinking about the application of these tenets to the oncourt play.  You could also say that maybe the numbers don't hold as much value on the defensive side of things.  Whatever the case, this is very, very good news.  The Rockets at times against Portland last month looked as if they had not even practiced defense.
  • miketheodio says 1 month ago

    not sure about leonard. spurs could be developing him slowly so he doesn't pick up bad habits. he's not really in a position to display his skills because that would inject selfishness into the system.

  • Journeymany says 1 month ago

    @rbf Good point about them maybe not being able to come out and say 'screw it, let's tank'. I also didn't realise you had to be out of the luxury for 2 years to reset the repeater tax. It may be a longer term rebuild anyway as I think they still have guys like JR Smith on long deals so maybe they will take 2 years out.

    I guess it all depends on what NY plans, which is why I said they still have some leverage unless Melo is willing to take a much, much lower deal which I think won't happen with Mrs. Melo and his entourage, not to mention the CAA clusterf**k. If you're saying the deal is Lin & Asik + those 4 2015 picks, I think that would definitely be in the ballpark of what they'd want - but I'm not keen on giving away 4 picks from our side as that is a lot of trading power and / or future players. Remember, trading their future away for Free Agents is what got NY into this sorry mess to start with, and I'm not convinced that we want to be looking at a 33-34 year old Melo on a max deal as a key part of the team when Harden should be hitting his peak in a few years. In addition with McHale's super-short rotations and lack of bench usage, it's highly likely that older players will burn out fast instead of like the Spurs' guys are.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Journeymany

    ahhh........I see.......your argument is based on the fact you think they want to tank next season.

    1. if they get Lin and Asik in trade they can use Lin's hype to fill the seats and Asik to gain more draft picks in addition to the drafts picks we end up handing over in a trade.

    2. there are already rumors Phil has told Felton he will be traded, so I don't think Phil has changed his mind. he doesn't want Felton. even if he manages to stay out of jail

    3. while tanking is what may end up happening in NY it won't be because their gunning for it. the media and fans there are brutal. patience is not a quality I would use to describe them. Phil has immediate pressure to right the ship Melo or no Melo. he may get some benefit becausethis hisfirst year, but that's about it. they don't want to hear he doesn't have the tools to work with. they want results, so he best get some tools to work with. trading Melo helps that cause

    4. as for draft picks.......if they get say.........our first rounder 2015 and all 3 of our 2015 second rounders. they get a late first rounder for Chandler, another late first rounder for Asik......they will come away with 3 first rounders and three second rounders. all these are a reasonable outcome. they would still have their own 2015 pick as well...........if I'm building a team those look like bricks to me especially since I was working with only1 pick before

    even if I was to believe they would outright tank, they still come away with more assets by working a trade instead of letting Melo walk. they can find other thing to do with Lin and Asik. they need draft picks. any small number of wins Lin or Asik would add to their record won't stop the snowball that is already rolling downhill. they aren't interested in resetting the repeater tax (besides they would need to be under the threshold for two years to reset it) and they will probably be back over it in 2015. they have got to give the fans something in 2015's season or it may end up looking like Custer's last stand

  • Journeymany says 1 month ago

    @rbf & JG I see where you're coming from, I just think you're quite optimistic!

    1) I think if you want to tank a season (which they should), you're better off with Felton as your starting PG assuming he doesn't end up in jail :lol:

    2) Bargnani can play center, and would be perfect for a proper tanking attempt.

    3) Fair enough, agree.

    4) But with Lin + Asik, they'll still be in the luxury tax. Then repeater tax kicks in and hurts bigtime, potentially causing issues for 2015-16 too.

    5) I agree. Chandler getting traded is actually the 1 thing imo that makes a Lin + Asik S&T much more likely. Amusingly though, even if they take ZERO salary back, losing Chandler / Melo and gaining Lin / Asik, they're STILL pretty much capped out at $71 million.

    6) Developing players has been the opposite of NY's philosophy the last few years. It'll be interesting to see if Jackson wants to / can change that.

    7&8) I agree money isn't a big issue for NY, but the repeater tax does become prohibitive after a while. If they want to reload big in 2015 FA, they could really use a year out of the tax to reset the repeater penalty.

    I get what you're saying about them taking whatever they can get if Melo wants to leave - however, I think a lot of people feel that Jackson actually thinks Melo is NOT the guy to build a championship team around and secretly is quite happy for him to go. The fact is whether he stays or goes, next season is a total bust for them, so the rebuild doesn't start till 2015 FA. In which case, they should be more interested in getting 2015 and 2016 1st round picks than 2 players who will be available in 2015 FA anyway.

    So my theory is that for their rebuild, what they would ideally do is:

    1) Let Melo walk

    2) Trade Chandler for 2015/16 picks or a developmental piece that Jackson wants

    In the trading for picks scenario, their salary would amazingly still be at around $54 million for next year - only $3 million or so below the salary floor. Then just sign 1 year rentals to fill the roster and flat out tank their way to the worst record in the league (and probably a no.1 pick if you believe in conspiracy theories). Doesn't that make the most sense?

  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    I don't understand the difficulty of trading lin. I get the PP contract, but his cap hit is only 8.3 million leaving room for a tanking team to get other salary dumps. Its also not like he's a terrible player. Can be very good given the situation and his huge fanbase will help counter that PP cost with merchandise purchases along with opening the team's brand who trades for him into the much desired Asian markets. The 25th (because we also do not want to be paying for that contract to hamper the cap flexibility) paired with lin should be fine and if need be, trade the 42nd too. Then trade asik to the celtics for a future 1st which could bring some great value down the road.

    I fully agree that Kawhi would not be who he is without the spurs, but even though I don't see him as a superstar. I'm expecting some to see him in allstar weekend very soon and a dangerous pippen to another Jordan.

    Just a few added notes. I could see Birdman following lebron to Houston and be our 3rd string center after Dmo. The guy is 35, there's not going to be much left in his career soon.

    We always talk about Jones failing against the best, but dominating against scrubs. Him and Dmo off the bench would dominate 2nd units. I think its going to be Dmo's break out year.

    Another major pull Houston has, which was big in Dwight's decision too was Hakeem. After Lebron seriously worked out with Hakeem is when his post game took off and he took up the mantle as the undisputed best player in the world. Every superstar who began their careers as elite, dominating athletes evolve into much more post players down the road when age gets to them just like kobe and Jordan for example. Being able to have unlimited access to him to continue working on his post game could be a huge deciding factor, just like dwight.

    I remember someone said lebron has no ties to anyone in Houston in another topic. Lebron and Howard have been known to be great friends for a long time being in the exact same situations for much of their careers. Being in small market teams in the east who could never pair other stars with them leading both of them carrying a squad of scrubs to the finals only to be defeated soundly. Both took huge hits to their public views when leaving their terrible situations. Both of them looking for championships and happy, winning situations.

    Best of the Big 3 would be Harden-Lebron-Howard You need at least on star guard and one young superstar so his improvement can cancel the other's decline which to be honest I think Lebron will still be a superstar for quite a while and depending on how much Hakeem can instill in dwight and if the mid range shot is true, then dwight's dominance could be longer than we expect.

  • Rahat Huq says 1 month ago

    Johnny Rocket: The Lakers are a spot that would seem to make sense for Lin.

    Majik19: Kawhi would be the perfect fit next to Harden....but there was no Harden when the pick was made.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @JG

    on the 2015 FA class............I really feel most of the players on that list will have their fates decided this summer. Love will find his home this summer (unless Minny is stupid). LMA ismore unlikely to leave now, Rondo is likely to find his home this summer (whether that be Boston or somewhere else......Houston?) the big names.......the franchise altering names will be gone. the others can build you a nice team if you can get them in combination. however then you're paying too much for a mediocre team. IMO one of the reasons the Rockets appear ready to go all in this summer is there won't be another chance to add to the team with this many options available next year. I think they think most of these guy will be gone next year too and they want to get in on the fun. if the big gun go down this year cap space next year seems less appealing.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    I'm 100% with RBF on this one. Also, don't forget the minimum salary requirements for each season. New York is required to spend a certain amount of money per the most recent CBA. Doesn't it make sense that they would love it if they could get 1 year contracts in exchange for Carmelo.

    Go look at their salary situation here. If they pick up all their options they only have $12M on the books after next season. Having the rights to Lin and Asik would be a good thing. Add to this that Chandler still has value on the open market (I'd say more than Asik due to his reputation and better hands). This gives them a trade piece they can use to try and get some more assets/pieces for the rebuild.

    Dallas has openly showed interest in him. I bet Phoenix would at least consider acquiring him. New Orleans could use Chandler. Atlanta has coveted a defensive anchor for years. Depending on what moves Boston makes, they might have interest. Cleveland could decide they are done with Varejao and his inconsistent health. The Lakers and Nuggets have reason to want Chandler as well.

    New York has zero reasons to keep him so why not ship him out for anything good as long as it keeps their 2015 cap open?

    Getting back to Melo, the only play NY has in trying to leverage him to stay is by not playing ball because, if memory serves, both Houston and Chicago have to dump salary in order to sign him outright. They might gamble that both teams fail to do so (a very risky gamble) which would force Melo back to the table in NY. Now, Melo could always sign a cap-friendly 1-year deal with one of these teams allowing them time to clear the necessary room....so yeah, NY has no leverage...none.

    New York has to already have their eyes on that 2015 class. There is a lot to choose from:

    Rajon Rondo, Goran Dragic, Millsap, Kyrie Irving (restricted), DeAndre Jordan, Marc Gasol, Kevin Love (player option), Aaron Afflalo (player option), LaMarcus Aldridge, and Kawhi Leonard (restricted). They could realistically sign three of these guys and hit the ground running (especially if one of them is Love or Aldridge).

  • Freebird says 1 month ago

    @majik19

    Actually, look at the draft boards at the time. Morris came from a high-powered Kansas program that was the odds-on favorite to win the National Championship that year. Kawhi was from that over-achieving little upstart of a SDSU school, and had NO national exposure. So it made a world of sense to jump on a Morris if one of them dropped to you in the draft.

    @rahat

    Nice lines of thinking. I think the Heat are disintegrating before our eyes. If Allen retires, and Battier already has, then I don't think they can find enough firepower to fill out the bench again. DWade looked done, Bosh looked irrelevant. LBJ carried that team for a lot longer than many expected, and maybe it's time to find new running mates.

    If there is interest in Lin and Asik for Carmelo, could there not be an argument that Miami would look at them, as well? At this point, LBJ is really the only guy I'd want from that roster, and it's fairly obvious that they need both positions.

    Which is better? Harden-Melo-D12, LBJ-Melo-D12, Harden-LBJ-D12?

    Edit: English

  • Cooper says 1 month ago Outside of the top five of almost any draft it's just a crapshoot and there's always guys that outperform their draft slot. faried butler parsons Thomas and Jackson went in the bottom of the first or second round. No one at the time was up in arms about Leonard going late lottery. Draft express said at best he's Shawn Marion.
  • majik19 says 1 month ago

    I disagree on the Morris over Kawhi logic. Don't get me wrong - I agree with you that Leonard would not be the force he is outside of the Spurs organization. They also completely remade his shot (read the ESPN piece of Chip Engelland for details). But he would be theperfect fit next to James Harden, with his 3 and D abilities. He may not have become the 3 point shooter that he is if the Rockets had drafted him, but I think he would still be a very strong defender (he has the length, athleticism, and desire).

    I also agree that he won't turn out to be the star that people currently believe he is. At best, I think his peak is this year's version of Paul George (better defender, maybe). He can't be the #1 option on a championship team. Maybe a #2.

    I'm not sure I understand your point on trading Harden for Carmelo. Was it that you think Lebron has a better chance of signing with a team with Melo on it than Harden? Because I would rather have Harden than Melo.

  • Cooper says 1 month ago The lakers would make sense for Lin at this point they just need bodies around Kobe.
  • Johnny Rocket says 1 month ago

    Rahat: what about trading Lin to the Lakers? The Lakers are so short of talent or any reason to watch them that they might be tempted to take a flier on Lin just to generate fan interest. The Lakers also don't have a draft choice next year, so they it is quite possible that they would be content with Lin and next year's first rounder. Keep in mind that the Laker's have plenty of cap space and have exactly zero chance of being relevant next year. The extra money they'd pay Lin (the non-cap portion of his contract) is rounding error for a team like the Lakers.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Journeymany

    if Melo couldn't get NY to the playoffs you believe Lin and Asik can? :unsure:I would have to disagree there. if we trade Lin and Asik to NY....

    1. NY doesn't have a PG so they could actually use Lin. he's popular there lest you forget Linsanty(that's unless you consider Felton a NBA player)

    2. there have already been rumors of NY attempting to trade Chandler, so they may need Asik too.

    3. both players (Lin/Asik) will be in the last year of their contracts which won't interfere with there plan for FA in 2015. true they want to add a major piece in the summer of 2015, but they still need to put a team on the floor in the season of 2015

    4. if they trade Melo their tax number will actually fall by 5 mil bringing in Lin and Asik

    5. if NY trades Chandler....replaces him with Asik their tax drops by another 14 mil yet they still have a center who is just as good and younger

    6. true NY has their own 2015 pick, but they won't get another one till 2017 first rounder and even then Denver has a right to swap picks. it's a fact they intend to do most of the heavy lifting in their rebuild through FA. however not all of it can be done there. they have got to develop roll players on the cheap in order to have room to pursue stars. the picks we have would not hold as much value to any one else, but NY is so devoid of assets our picks look like a fist full of pearls to them.

    7. with all that money talk understand this NY doesn't care about money. Dolan wipes his butt with 100 dollar bills. their only issue is trying to get more bang for the buck. they really don't care about spending........remember they just paid a boat load of money for the dumpster fire they had on the floor this season and didn't even blink an eye. if they somehow kept Melo they would be paying a boat load of money next year for the same dumpster fire.

    8. NY can not afford to allow Melo to get away from them with no compensation. for an example just look at LA. it would set their rebuild back for years, yet they have no power or leverage in this situation. Melo is in the driver seat. what ever he decides they have no real choice but to play ball if they expect to recover any value from his leaving at all. Phil Jackson is no dummy, he knows that.

    you have a right to your opinion and I respect that, but it's just hard for me to see where you are coming from on this point. while NY wouldn't be thrilled doing business with us no one is ever thrilled with the deal they get when they bargaining from a position of weakness. you whine and cry but at the end of the day you take what you can get. half a loaf of bread is better than no bread at all

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago He has all of the physical tools to be a great player. He's also shown massive improvement. He's not there yet but he's on an upward trajectory.
  • Johnny Rocket says 1 month ago

    Leonard is a much better version of T. Jones or C. Parsons. Leonard has some great skills that are amplified by his teammates, but he couldn't carry a team's offense, and his defense (as good as it is) depends on bigs who know how to help.

  • Journeymany says 1 month ago

    @rbf - I guess we can agree to disagree :rolleyes: Taking back Lin & Asik in a S&T will cost them a lot because of the repeater tax. And Lin & Asik will not help their rebuild, which starts only AFTER Bargnani and Stoudemire come off the books at the end of 2015.

    So if they just let Melo go for nothing, at the end of 2015, they stand to have loads of cap space and their own draft pick. How would having Lin & Asik on board help that at all? Same cap space situation, but your pick is probably a load worse - they could even make the playoffs, remember this is the East we're talking about! So I don't see any incentive for the Knicks to take those contracts off us at all.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 1 month ago I disagree on Kawhi. He has shown improvement every year and continues to get better. He also by all accounts puts in the work to get better. I wouldn't be surprised if he handles the rock more next year.
  • Red94 says 1 month ago New post: Houston Rockets Potpourri for June 17
    By: rahat huq

    • Why not Houston?  I wrote last week about the Lebron James scenario, illustrating what would need to happen for the game's greatest player to bring his talents to the third coast, noting at the end that it wouldn't happen.  Lebron to Houston is the scenario that most Rockets fans dare not contemplate, readily dismissing as implausible.  But why?  Why not Houston?  If the Rockets are being described as "ready-made" for Carmelo Anthony, would they not hold similar appeal for James?  The key distinction is that for James, staying for one more year in Miami is a viable option; that is not the case for Anthony.  But if it becomes clear that James is open to leaving the Heat, why would Houston stand second to any suitor?  He would at least have to give them a look.  Get the Ipad ready, just in case.
    • And on that point, how do you navigate the waters of free agency with so many options available?  The first step is trading Asik and Lin.  Or is it?  Do you hold onto them until you know for sure you have a commitment?  More importantly, if you are given indication that you are in the running for James, but you have received a commitment from Anthony, do you hold off for James or secure the bird in hand?  The Texans moved quickly on Johnathan Joseph when Nnamdi Asomugha was still in play.  While Asomugha was clear-cut superior to Joseph, James might end up the greatest player of all-time.  It's an intricate matter.
    • The money move would be trading James Harden for Anthony and then signing James, if that's what it took to sign James.  But like our Howard for Kevin Love scenarios last year, that won't happen.  Just sayin...

    • I would not even give Dwyane Wade my mid-level exception at this point.  
    • Every time I mention the difficulties of trading Jeremy Lin, several of you cite the Warriors' clearing of $30million before last season's signing of Andre Iguodala, stating it can easily be done.  It's not quite the same.  As Zach Lowe noted in a piece last week, there will be reluctance to create the next super-team and don't look for Sam Hinkie to bail Houston out yet again - the 76ers' GM has his own reputation to build, even if simply absorbing Lin for assets would actually be beneficial to that team's end objective.  I'm not saying it can't be done.  But it will come at a steep cost.  The Rockets clearly are confident they can make it happen, though they've been known to bluff in the past (see: Fake Trade Deadline, Asik, last season).  It might even be a scenario where you'd trade Asik for a draft pick, and then package that draft pick with your own draft pick, along with Lin, for like a trade exception and some prospect currently in Zambia that no one has ever heard of.  That would be the best case scenario.  The likelier route will require sacrificing one of Terrence Jones and Donatas Motiejunas, and hopefully not the latter.
    • I can't help but think that Motiejunas on the Spurs would look like the best European import since [insert punchline>.
    • If the Celtics can get Asik and Kevin Love, they are right there again in the East.
    • On the Spurs: Everyone thinks they've gleaned some sort of sacred truth about team-building from this Spurs championship, citing player development etc. in opposition to star-chasing.  Can we please stop?  The Spurs model is inimitable, even moreso than that of the Thunder model of getting three top lottery picks in three consecutive years.  It's not as simple as saying, "hey, we don't need 'Melo, we need to develop our own players."  You want to follow the Spurs?  First, go draft Tim Duncan.  If you're rolling your eyes, you're underestimating the importance of that first domino in the process that has elapsed over the past 20 years.  Popovich has the capital to coach from the standpoint of ideal when his superstar supports him 100%.  He can scream at anyone for even the slightest miscue when he's already able to scream at Duncan.  Want to know what happens in any other city?  The coach is gone.  Want to guess what would happen if McHale tore into James Harden for a slight error?  All it would take is Harden implying he's unhappy and McHale is gone.  If you're citing the Spurs as some duplicable model, you don't quite understand that ego-management dynamic that is so critical to NBA coaching and environment.  You can't create that.  I realize we're all excited here over this championship through its apparent affirmation of our predisposed belief in the evil of the Miami Heat, but let's all just calm down.  The Heat just went to four straight titles after creating a super-team.  The Rockets can also create a super-team.  That's the easier route.
    • On Kawhi Leonard: A lot of talk these past few days revisiting Morey's blunder in selecting Marcus Morris over Leonard with the 14th pick in that draft, an introspection which I find otherwise unfair.  For one, I don't think Leonard develops like this outside of that Spurs ecosystem.  Two, while the kid was phenomenal, he's not the budding superstar everyone is anointing him as and I'd venture to guess that if you took him out of San Antonio, that nonsense would stop.  Great, great, great roleplayer - amazingly perfect roleplayer.  But he doesn't have the handles or skillset to be the star everyone is describing him as, outside of that dynamic Spurs system.  But the greater point is that Morris was a perfectly logical pick.  In law, we have something called 'the business judgment rule' whereby the standard for managerial negligence is not result, but rather process in determination.  Sure, it's easy to get a few cheap laughs out of looking at that pick now, but at the time, those Rockets were desperately in need of a homerun.  For a team with Kyle Lowry as its best player, taking Marcus Morris with the hope of converting him to small forward represented a "swing for the fences" move - they didn't have the luxury of selecting another roleplayer when that was all their team was composed of.  It didn't work out in the end, but the judgment was sound and rational.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    @JG

    I agree he's not worth max money........in fact ......because the Rockets allowed him a release from his contract early that should buy us a discount. I say anything over 10 mil per let him walk. we can not pay him more than that and maintain control of our bottom line. he is valuable, but he has a limit where that value will be overrun. if he wants more than that I would be ok with the Rockets letting him walk

    I do have to say, there's probably some mutual back scratching going on in Morey's office. Parsons gets paid early, and he stays out of the market until the rockets sign a big name FA, then resign him to a reasonable deal.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @JG

    I agree he's not worth max money........in fact ......because the Rockets allowed him a release from his contract early that should buy us a discount. I say anything over 10 mil per let him walk. we can not pay him more than that and maintain control of our bottom line. he is valuable, but he has a limit where that value will be overrun. if he wants more than that I would be ok with the Rockets letting him walk

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    @JG

    it's not that I think Parsons can't be replaced. he can and very easily at that. I would like to keep him. if we can get Melo without giving up either Parsons or T-Jones I would be overjoyed. call me greedy if you will but the thought of only giving up Lin + Asik + D-Mo and draft picks and landing Melo is equal to having your cake and eating it too.

    I realize this. My rant was more inclined towards the worry about him signing an offer sheet and then I went that direction as well--and it wasn't entirely directed at you--many have voiced concerns about this Parsons signing and I think it is very overblown.

    I'm with you, keeping Parsons is preferred because he is a solid player, has three years under his belt with the team, and is a glue guy for us, but if he wants to be paid max money he will have to get it elsewhere.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @JG

    it's not that I think Parsons can't be replaced. he can and very easily at that. I would like to keep him. if we can get Melo without giving up either Parsons or T-Jones I would be overjoyed. call me greedy if you will but the thought of only giving up Lin + Asik + D-Mo and draft picks and landing Melo is equal to having your cake and eating it too.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    I keep repeating this to no avail. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Parsons must SIGN....SIGN...an offer sheet before it makes one tiny bit of difference. Everyone is afraid of an offer being made and they shouldn't be. If Parsons signs one of these offers then we will all immediately know he was always about the money first and foremost. At that point, I'm fine if he leaves. He is replaceable. Think about it....there are quality SF's all over the league and we can get one with ease. Besides Melo, there is Deng, Ariza, Evan Turner ( :unsure:+ he's restricted), Gordon Hayward (also restricted), Shawn Marion, Danny Granger, Marvin Williams, Caron Butler, Mike Miller, CJ Miles, Al-Farouq Aminu, PJ Tucker, Xavier Henry, Wesley Johnson, Jordan Hamilton, Anthony Tolliver, Chris Douglas-Roberts, James Jones, and Cartier Martin are all available.

    Phew, that's a long list. I'd be pretty happy with 11 or 12 of those guys and could live with the rest. I guarantee Morey has told Chandler his cap--meaning Chandler knows that if he signs an offer sheet over X amount of money the Rockets will not be matching it and he is gone. Thus, there is nothing to worry about.

    Teams can offer as much as they want, until he signs one nothing matters. The bottom line is we can get Parsons' production from guys like Deng, Williams, Johnson, Hayward, Ariza, Turner, Miles, Tucker, and Hamilton plus we might get some extra defense from some of those guys. Sorry--I know we all love Chandler, but I think he has just about reached the apex of what he can bring to the table. He's Toni Kukoc.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Cooper

    to further that thought a little more......... my biggest worry in sign and trading for Melo is it will hard cap us at the luxury tax apron. depending on what we have to pay him could interfere with Parsons. if we sign Melo for 20+ mil per and a team gives Parsonsa buck wild offer it will put some hard decisions on the table.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @JG/Cooper

    I third that motion........totally agree. saving flexibility is only useful if you cash it in at some point to make your run. I think that's where the Rockets are. we are close enough to go all in for the next 3-4 years on a significant piece to puzzle.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    The rockets could trade Howard today and half the teams in the league would put in at least a decent offer, Harden is easily tradeable. Parsons even at 10mil is tradeable. Melo probably wouldn't be as easy but he's not an albatross even around 18-20mill. I get having flexibility but sometimes you got to cash in all your chips for a 3yr or so stretch, especially in larger markets where the lux tax isn't keeping you from making money.

    Agreed, even with his "bad back" and "terrible season" in LA teams were lining up trying to get Howard. Melo, for being so untrade-able, is about to be traded for the second time. Also, you don't have to win every trade--I don't get this mentality. Sometimes the win is simply getting rid of whoever it is you don't want anymore. I mean, who thinks Detroit trading Josh Smith for....well, anyone else, really.....is a bad trade? Ultimately, that move would make them better--which is the point.

    The only thing we wold be "locked" into is finding cheap, young talent and quality older ring-chasers to put around them. Fortunately, Morey is pretty good at both of those things as far as I can tell. After 4-5 years, contracts expire, management and coaches will re-evalaute everything and we will go from there. This isn't a life sentence in prison with no chance of parole. It's a few years of an NBA franchise.

  • Cooper says 1 month ago The rockets could trade Howard today and half the teams in the league would put in at least a decent offer, Harden is easily tradeable. Parsons even at 10mil is tradeable. Melo probably wouldn't be as easy but he's not an albatross even around 18-20mill. I get having flexibility but sometimes you got to cash in all your chips for a 3yr or so stretch, especially in larger markets where the lux tax isn't keeping you from making money.
  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    Two things. First, why are we locked into that core? We can't make trades once we sign Melo? It is only a few years--there will be life after those contracts.

    Second, who do we need in order to contend? Remember, none of the league's "stars" won a trophy this year.

    Well if we're talking about a battle of talent, I can't say the rockets are clear favorites and as you seen the past finals. System and skill trump everything which leads us to do we have a top notch system, game plan, coaching to compete at the highest level. Then depending how they go after melo, the bench could be depleted and as I say again these finals prove how valuable depth is. Finally the rockets will beLocked up with melo, howard, and harden contracts plus if they want to resign parsons to about 10 million and if you want to talk about trading max contracts. Well it gets very dicey there to say the least.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Not necessary but it would be expensive by all means. I'm rather neutral on melo. Yes of course it makes the rockets better, but then they're locked into that core and I just don't see them winning it all. They would be great and very entertaining, but rings I don't see.

    Two things. First, why are we locked into that core? We can't make trades once we sign Melo? It is only a few years--there will be life after those contracts.

    Second, who do we need in order to contend? Remember, none of the league's "stars" won a trophy this year.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Do you know how Pop teach team work and unselfishness? They (Pop and R.C.) got rid of selfish and low I.Q. players.

    I don't think Pop can magically turn the bad boy to be a saint. Even if Pop was our coach, he may or may not be successful.

    Everyone should take the time to read that article I linked to above. It's a bit long, but very good. To address your question, dbd, I will include this quote from said article:

    ""Yes, we're disciplined with what we do. But that's not enough. Relationships with people are what it's all about. You have to make players realize you care about them. And they have to care about each other and be interested in each other. Then they start to feel a responsibility toward each other. Then they want todofor each other."

    Pop also goes on to answer the reporter's question about his "innovations" with this snippet:

    "Oh, hell, I don't know anything about innovation," he says, rising. "Here is my innovation: I drafted Tim Duncan. Okay? End of story."

    Like I said before, we don't have the luxury of a Tim Duncan-caliber player being with us from his rookie year until the end. We've got James Harden, Dwight Howard, and whoever ends up coming along for the ride. There is no guaranteed formula for success, all you can do is put yourself in the best position to succeed and then wait and see if the shots go in or not. (Let's not forget that Tim Duncan missed not one, but two, bunnies last year that cost them a championship--it happens)

  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    It's only "luxury tax hell" when you're paying for players who are old, broken, or both. When it's for a trio of stars in their prime it's called

    1312576686_charlie-sheen-winning-tshirt.

    Not necessary but it would be expensive by all means. I'm rather neutral on melo. Yes of course it makes the rockets better, but then they're locked into that core and I just don't see them winning it all. They would be great and very entertaining, but rings I don't see.

  • dbd says 1 month ago

    Do you know how Pop teach team work and unselfishness? They (Pop and R.C.) got rid of selfish and low I.Q. players.

    I don't think Pop can magically turn the bad boy to be a saint. Even if Pop was our coach, he may or may not be successful.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    It's only "luxury tax hell" when you're paying for players who are old, broken, or both. When it's for a trio of stars in their prime it's called

    1312576686_charlie-sheen-winning-tshirt.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    New York has zero leverage over Melo. They are about to become the jilted lover in this relationship and are down on their knees begging for him to stay so they can prove they can be good enough. I can be better....those days are in the past, I swear.... :wub:

    Meanwhile, Melo has already broke up with them in his heart. The only way he stays is if LeBron walks through the door and dons a Knicks jersey.

    New York does not care about the luxury tax--they are making money....lots of it.

    If they are smart, they will target a player on another team that they covet and tell Chicago, Houston, etc. to find a deal that lands usthat guyplus some draft picks and we're in business. Neither Houston nor Chicago can give NY what they really want: a replacement star. This is part of why Lin should be appealing to NY in a trade. He can lead the band of merry men that the Knicks will be left with, be a crowd favorite, and win some games for them while not being too good to stay in the lottery.

    Something that crossed my mind, but seemed too far-fetched to mention (until now, apparently) is a Detroit Pistons trade. They could bundle Brandon Jennings and Josh Smith (did you all feel the Earth tilt a little from that collective eye-roll?) in a sign and trade. It's not preposterous for New York to do this; although, I am pretty sure 99% of you disagree. Meanwhile, Detroit still has plenty of cap room to sign a free agent PG afterwards like Lowry or Bledsoe to a high dollar deal and still re-sign Monroe next season. They could also go with one of the cheaper PG's (Sessions, Vasquez, Thomas, etc.) and sign Lance Stephenson.

    I know it's not exactly a destination city these days (was it ever?), but SVG has huge cache and with a roster like that in the East you're going places. Lowry, Caldwell-Pope, Melo, Monroe, and Drummond? That's a good team (on paper). Ramon Sessions (who would do well in SVG's system), Stephenson, Melo, Monroe, and Drummond?

    I know it's a tough pill to swallow, but don't count out Detroit from making a big splash this off-season.

  • Buckko says 1 month ago

    Honestly I would much rather just dump lin with the 25th and trade asik for a future 1st and lose the MLE rather than trade demo or jones to New York. We need our depth plus a full melo super max would send the rockets to dangerous luxury tax hell.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    We may need to ban the phrase, "look at the Spurs". :rolleyes:

    Can everyone who feels compelled to compare us to them stop, contemplate, and before proceeding with whatever relation you are about to make try to realize that they are a team 15 years into a process. Yes, their process and strategy have worked out great. We, on the other hand, are heading into year 3 of our process. We do not have one of the greatest players of all time. We do not have one of the greatest coaches of all time. If it were as simple as saying, "well, just do what San Antonio does", then there would be a dozen teams littered with Euro/South American guys who boast a complete skill set of dribbling, passing, shooting, and team defense.

    Or maybe we could all just read this article from Sports Illustrated

    popovich-si-4-29-13.jpg

    San Antonio understands teamwork and unselfishness. Most NBA teams and players are better described by this moniker: Me First and the Gimme Gimmes(which is also the world's greatest punk cover band if you're into that kind of stuff :) )

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Cooper

    I don't think either team Chicago or Houston will open cap space for Melo except as a last resort. they will engage NY in trade talks. so it really comes down to where Melo decides he wants to go. Melo is in the driver's seat

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Rahat

    totally agree. I have not heard a creditable argument for not going after Melo. your point about constant change in the roster was spot on. it's not better to keep pieces if they are underperforming just for the sake of continuity. actually getting Melo will aid continuity because at that point the main core of this team will be set.

    I know some are doubtful NY will engage in trade talks, but they are so devoid of assets for their rebuild I don't think they really have a choice. it's easy to see what happens if they choose not to..........just look at the Lakers. letting stars leave without compensation is a bad idea. no matter what picks they get they willstill have something to work with when the opposing option leaves a much tougher road back to respectability. they may be pissed because they couldn't get the whole loaf of bread, but to lose Melo without at least getting a couple of slices would be devastating.

  • Cooper says 1 month ago

    If NY does go that route Chicago would only have to amnesty boozer and find someone to take Dunleavy for nothing which shouldn't be difficult so while it would give them some more negotiating strength over houston they would be risking him leaving for Chicago more.Maybe NY is ok with just letting melo go and I doubt phil is excited about a package for melo with the main pieces being asik and lin but for only a year but maybe he thinks he could flip asik at the deadline or Dolan puts some pressure on him to get something for melo to make the team semi interesting next season.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Journeymany

    I disagree. it's true they will drop under the tax without Melo, but they have nothing but their 2015 pick and you can't build a team with 1draft pick. they need other assets and have no way to get them without trading to acquire them. losing Melo is going to set them back for years, so they may as well use him to acquire what they need for a rebuild. it can speed up the process. I think Phil is smart enough to know that. as long as they don't have to take back any contracts that go beyond next year it won't interfere with their plans, so it would be smart from their perspective.

  • dbd says 1 month ago

    Third star is very desirable but not an absolute necessary. Look at Spurs, their "Big 3" is not actually big in production and minutes.

    Their success is a product of team work, good balance, and deep bench.

  • Red94 says 1 month ago New post: On the Houston Rockets' pursuit of Carmelo Anthony: Part 2
    By: rahat huq

    I did not think in June 2013 that the Houston Rockets would acquire Dwight Howard; today, the possibility of signing Carmelo Anthony is very real.

    The big takeaways from Adrian Wojnarowski's Saturday report are as follows:

    1. Obviously, the title: Anthony is leaning towards leaving the Knicks, with Houston and the Bulls as the leading destinations.
    2. Phil Jackson has turned off Anthony with his public implications that Anthony take less money.  This is huge and possibly the biggest domino: the major incentive to stay in New York was the money.  If even that isn't there, there really isn't much incentive to stay put for any athlete with any sort of competitive drive.
    3. At least according to the report, the possibility of a sign&trade with New York is still on the table.  Since Anthony-to-Houston had become a thing, I had been speculating that a sign&trade might be possible given the Knicks' potential interest in Jeremy Lin (as opposed to any other team).  As the weeks have passed, reports seemed to indicate that Houston would need to trade Asik and Lin separately as the only scenario by which to make an Anthony play.  It's comforting to know that at least from Wojnarowski's source, whichever party that may be, there is belief that a sign&trade may still be palatable.  Why?  Because not only could Anthony realize his full max but in that scenario, the Rockets may have a better chance at keeping their roster intact.  Though its anyone's guess at this point, unloading Lin separately might require Houston attaching more in the package than New York would demand if they actually deem him desirable (or acceptable).  It's anyone's guess.
    4. This is a continuation from above, but so significant that it requires its own bullet point: if the Rockets remain over the cap and acquire Anthony via a sign&trade, they would retain their salary exceptions through which they could add depth to the roster.  This option is not there if dropping below the cap to sign Anthony outright.  While I have my doubts whether Les Alexander would spend to such a degree, the option in such a scenario would be there.
    5. Even from the most conservative estimates, Houston would have the flexibility to pay Anthony $19million annually.  Nothing new, but the point must be underscored: $19million is quite the step up from the estimated $10million/year the Heat would be able to pay Anthony if receiving a pay cut from all its stars.

    The Field

    I don't think the prospect of James, Wade, Bosh, and Anthony all taking severe pay cuts to join forces is as outlandish as some have made it seem.  Still, this Finals helps Houston's chances.  Had the Heat barely lost, or at least gone down in respectable fashion, the logical extension might have been that bringing in the cavalry in the form of Anthony would push them back over the top.  But with the way Miami was so categorically outclassed by the Spurs in this series, they need more than Anthony: by extension, taking such a pay cut when it might not even be enough seems much less desirable.

    The Bulls are tailor-made for Anthony.  They have defense and coaching, the two things Houston does not have, and they could plug Anthony directly into their lineup to fill their scoring needs.  But can anyone depend on the health of Derrick Rose at this point?  I'd actually venture to say that even without Rose, with just Anthony, the Bulls would have enough to seriously contend in the East.  I think that highly of their coaching.  But its a star-centric league where stars view success through the prism of other stars.  While the reality might be that Chicago's defense and scheme might be enough, Anthony may not be of that opinion, instead interpreting the situation as yet another where he'd be alone in carrying the load.

    While my allegiances are transparent, I think Houston is the logical frontrunner.  Anthony would be flanked by James Harden and Dwight Howard and its unlikely he and his handlers are aware of how great a mess this team's coaching situation has been.

    Why Anthony?

    Since the story broke, and in the weeks previous, I've seen maddening arguments against the acquisition of Anthony, several characterized by severe failures in logic.  Foremost among these charges is that Houston's primary need is defense and that adding yet another offensively oriented player will do nothing in aiding toward that goal.  By extension, thus, the thinking goes that Anthony is an unworthy target.

    First, you'd be hard-pressed to find someone who more vocally criticized the Houston defense in last month's epic collapse against the Blazers.  When you say that Houston needs defense, you are preaching to the choir.  But defense (and coaching, another on the list of cited "bigger problems") and personnel upgrade are not mutually exclusive events.  It's not some either/or where you can only choose one and moreover, just because an acquisition doesn't fit both needs doesn't mean its not worth attaining.  As I said on Twitter, this would be like suggesting that someone who is both homely and obese should not aspire towards weight loss because they would be ugly regardless.  You try to improve yourself in any way that you can.

    But furthermore, is there seriously a sentiment that the Houston defense would actually deteriorate with Anthony replacing Terrence Jones in the lineup?  Terrence Jones.  Anthony is not by any stretch of the imagination a good defender.  But apart from shot-blocking, he is not inferior to Terrence Jones on the defensive end.

    There is also something to the thinking that sometimes, offense can serve as defense.  Let's put it this way: Omer Asik and Dwight Howard are widely regarded as two of the top interior defenders in all of basketball.  Those two were collectively destroyed by LaMarcus Aldridge and I'd guess that some of that had to do with the fact that Aldridge did not need to expend any energy in guarding Asik and Terrence Jones at the other end.  While Anthony may not be able to stop Aldridge, the latter cannot guard the former at the other end, at least requiring that Aldridge exert some effort on both sides of the court.

    Realize that I am not arguing that defense is not a concern.  It is and Morey will need to put a coaching staff in place that can address the team's disastrous scheme and indiscipline.  But acquiring Anthony is not counter to that goal.  If this team is going to improve its defense, it is going to have to be through better coaching.  Serge Ibaka isn't on the market.  Get Anthony and then implement a better scheme.

    On constant change

    A common argument is that "Houston will never win with the constant tinkering.  There's no continuity."

    I wholeheartedly agree.  Morey should have just stayed pat with the Lowry/Brooks/Ariza triumvirate.  We would have won the title by now.

    On ball sharing

    There is also the argument that acquiring Anthony would be disastrous with the presence of James Harden already on the roster.  That very well could be true.  But I envision Anthony playing as he did in the Olympics, operating as a stretch '4', who can catch and shoot and capitalize without needing to create off his own dribble.  When defenses tighten in the fourth quarter, I envision Anthony, boasting the best mid-range arsenal in basketball, carrying the load of the anemic Houston offense.

    It may not work.  There's reason to think that the ego of James Harden is prohibitive in such a divvying of spotlight.  And of course, Houston's biggest need is better coaching and a better scheme.  Until they address that, they won't do anything.  Even with Anthony, until there is indication that the coaching staff has implemented a coherent strategy on both ends of the floor, I would not even list Houston as among the serious class-A contenders in the West.

    But none of that is sufficient reason to rule out pursuing Anthony.

    Houston has other severe problems, but they could use a talent upgrade as well.  Ultimately, the notion of fans of a team that just got ousted in the first round, yet again, turning their nose up at a top-15 player is...well, preposterous.

    As it stands, the Western Conference is an arms race and Houston is lagging severely behind.  The gap between the Rockets and Thunder/Clippers is quite monumental.  This does not include the Spurs who still have not gone away.  Unfortunately, the Rockets are not yet at the point where they can focus merely on incremental improvements.  They need to solidify their core talent and Anthony represents that need.

  • Journeymany says 1 month ago

    NY actually has more bargaining power over Melo than you think - because if he comes off the books, they immediately fall out of the luxury tax. You talk about them wanting something back - but actually, why would they? They still have the awful contracts of Stoudemire and Bargnani to wait out, and as they actually have their own 2015 pick, they'd be better off getting out of the repeater luxury tax and flat out tanking their way to a lottery pick next year. If they traded Chandler for some picks and went with Felton / 2 warm bodies / Stoudemire / Bargnani that would do it :D

    So if they did play hardball with Melo, Morey would be left having to trade Lin & Asik for cap space when every other GM would have a gun to his head knowing what he wants. In that scenario, I think we'd be better off just making a couple tweaks and waiting things out rather than gutting the roster, as more offense is not really the priority for this team.

    And I think Sefolosha would be great for this team. He may have had a lousy playoffs, but I think if you asked most people who was the biggest playoff bust this year, a lot of votes would go to one of our 2 franchise players... :ph34r:

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    Getting back to the mid-level guys thoughts.....presuming we don't bring in one of the three stars, there are some really nice pieces.

    I keep forgetting Pau Gasol is out there. I know it didn't work out in LA, but I'm pretty sure that wasn't 100% the player's fault. There is no reason they can't play together. He has said he'd like to close out his career with a contender and that length of contract is important....don't be surprised to see him in a Heat Jersey or maybe even with OKC for a cap-friendly number on a 4 yr. deal. Of course there is the opportunity to play in Memphis, but he may not want to back up Z-Bo as he has said he feels healthier than he has in years.

    If we end up moving Lin I also really like Steve Blake. I like him a bit more than Devin Harris because I think he can run an offense and set up team mates better. He is also moving into the twilight of his career and just wants to be on a contender. His defense, at this point, is not so great, but as a back up PG he'll keep the offense flowing. Maybe Canaan is ready to play more serious minutes and we won't need to bring in a vet PG B)

    Don't be surprised to see Toure Murray (PG from NY) get a look. He's another defense-oriented PG who excels in pick n roll defense. On offense, he can get to the rim and draw fouls, but his jumper could use some work. If we aren't getting a floor general for that spot then another defensive weapon sounds good to me. He's turnover prone, but if he is playing a 3&D role that should be minimized. He already played a year for Rio Grande Valley and is a hometown kid from Klein Forest.

    Shelvin Mack seems like he is ready for a Kyle-Lowry-type breakout and in Atlanta he is gong to be 3rd on the depth chart as they bring Schroeder into the fold.

    Morey has his work cut out for him. There are a ton of players with plenty of upside sitting out there....deciding which ones have a skill set that will get maximized here is the hard part.

    If we don't go for a big trade and we only lose Garcia in the opt-out I'd be pretty happy heading into next season re-signing Jordan Hamilton, trying to bring Greg Smith back (if he's healthy), and getting someone with some defensive acumen at any position really. I'm excited to see who Morey tabs as our guy in free agency and in the draft.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    my dream scenario is still for us to trade with NY sending Lin, Asik, Casspi and Powell + 2014 second, 2015 first, 2015 second netting Carmelo. sign A-Bradley with MLE. sign Parsons 4 years 42 mil. ourteam would look like this

    PG = Beverly/Bradley/Canaan

    SG = Harden/Daniels/Garcia

    SF = Parsons/Covington/Hamilton

    PF = Carmelo/T-Jones/D-Mo

    C = Howard/vet minimum quality backup

    Ideally for backup center signing someone likeJ-Oneil, Okaforor Cambyto play about 12 minutes a game. maybe see if we can reacquire G-Smith. this spells championship to me. IMO it gives our youngsters Covington, Canaan, Daniels and our 2014 first rounder time to blossom while still chasing the goal/gold

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @Cooper

    Thabo was a dud in the playoffs, but will still command more than a vet minimum IMO. if we can get him at vet minimum I would consider that a steal

  • Cooper says 1 month ago

    Thabo was kind of a dud in the playoffs but he'd be worth a shot around the vet min or a part of the mid level exception. I like jodie meeks if the lakers let him go. Maybe someone like Danny granger or shawn marion on the wing and a big like Okafor or Gasol would be some solid veteran guys to fill out the bench a little better than last year.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @FSS

    I misunderstood your post then. sorry.I thought you were comparing the two options. I would agree with many of these players as upgrades, but our availability to sign most will diminish with the acquisition of a star. if we acquire a star via trade which is most likely.......signing Parsons will probably take us into tax territory. realistically we only have minimum salaried players as options at that point. the front office will more than likely try to save a little once we get above the tax

  • feelingsupersonic says 1 month ago I pretty much agree rockets best fan and here's the latest:

    http://mweb.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24588025/report-carmelo-anthony-already-leaning-toward-bulls-and-rockets
  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    to expand on this a little further........right now I believe Melo is ours to lose. this is a 2 horse race.......Chicago and Houston. Melo will leave NY and one of these 2 will be the winner. the reason I think we are the front runner is

    1. our team overall is younger

    2. we have a history of being for the most part healthy

    3. Howard and Melo's friendship

    4. we are able to keep more of our team in acquiring Melo

    5. Chicago is cheap....our owner isn't

    6. our nostate income tax situationmeans Melo will get more of hismoney

    7. our front office is more aggressive in championship chasing than Chicago

    I am predicting we sign Melo just like I predicted we would sign Howard last year. we are viewed in the league as a rising powerhouse. I think Melo wants to be part of that. the fact that our owner won't be squeamish about paying him his money will send a clear message to him.

  • feelingsupersonic says 1 month ago I'm not discussing acquiring a role player versus a star in any way. I don't think I wrote anything to suggest that. I actually think if the Rockets get Melo that someone like Sefalosha will be available for a couple million. I also still like Devin Harris to add to a tier of players you all are not discussing.
  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @G

    while I don't agree on ATL in the Melo race.......I do totally agree with you on the way players view destination cities. it's more about finding the right situation team wise and less about the glamor of living in a certain location now (except when talking about somewhere like Minny or the Bucks). that part of your statement is very well presented...........now that ATL stuff :lol:while I will agree that team looks good....I don't think Melo would ever seriously consider them. he wants to play with other stars at this point in his career. outside of Horford none of the others can make that claim and I don't think he will view them as his among his best possible situations. I also disagree that NY has anything except a remote possibility in signing Melo. seems to me Phil's presence and handling of the situation thus far is pointing Melo to the door. IMO NY is making the very same mistake LA made last year. they are depending on the glamor of playing intheir city and offering more moneyto win the day. I think that approach will lead to an exit for Melo. we are no longer in a time where people are willing to wait for glory.....they want it yesterday. they don't want to be told how we're building something....they want to be told you're the final piece to winning. Melo's at that point. just like Howard last year he is searching for something more than money or playoffs or glamor.....he's searching for a championship contending situation.

    @FSS

    make no mistake I still prefer Melo, but I would not be the least bit upset if the Rockets went in less than a star and more upgrade varies aspects of the team direction. I like Affalo, Pau, Lowry and others who I think would add to what we already have working, but the acquisition of a star will give me hope in one critical area that the upgrade approach won't........we may have acquired enough talent to overrun our coaches short comings. so I'm still leaning toward getting a star. if McHale was kept here for recruitment purposes it's time for him to earn his money.

  • feelingsupersonic says 1 month ago Would Harden welcome Artest? I'm not sure about Artest, maybe if this team was a true contender and Artest was a tenth guy that added grit but otherwise not sure I see it.

    To me Sefalosha is the perfect pickup in that he should be a relative bargain and could probably be signed for two years or something favorable for the Rockets. He is very familiar with all the Western Conference guards and wings and especially the Thunder which could be useful in the playoffs. He can relieve Beverley covering some Western Conference point guards so Beverley isn't spent halfway into the season with his style of play.
  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    I would simply add that there is a 3rd team in the running for Carmelo's consideration.

    NY Knicks and Phil Jackson.

    I don't need to say anything else at this moment about that additional possibility as true NBA fans already know the benefits Carmelo would retain by staying in NYC and the historical Madison Square Garden.

    I agree with you, Rick, that NY is a player--for multiple reasons--and Phil is definitely one of those. However, I do think that history and legacy have shifted recently such that the Celtics, Knicks, and Lakers do not have the stranglehold on legit destinations like they once did.

    The college game has shifted largely due to a glut of talent and the pervasiveness of 24-hour media exposure. Kids don't have to go to UNC, UK, KU, UCLA, etc. to succeed and be seen. They can play anywhere they like.

    I think the same is becoming true in the NBA. The dynamics of team selection are changing--at least for the upper tier players. The Lakers are finding out the hard way and are very begrudgingly realizing that players won't come there "just because". I found it amusing when Houston trotted out their "Legacy of Bigs" slogan for Dwight. Does that really matter? If we made a list of reasons Dwight came here would that make the top 15?

    No, these days star players have carved out quite a bit of leverage and can get themselves into just about any situation they desire (despite the recent CBA debacle). Melo can choose to play for money, for championships, or for fun. It's his world and his choice. We can all try to guess where he winds up and why, but I would not rank history nor legacy too highly on that list.

    I think Atlanta is a big-time dark horse in this race. If they can get a team with Teague, Korver, Melo, Millsap/Horford/Antic plus Dennis Schroeder, Mike Scott, Cartier Martin, Demarre Carrol, Stevenson, etc.....that's a lot of talent that can immediately compete in the East....and don't forget who has been raiding the Spurs' organization with Danny Ferry and now Budenholzer. Atlanta, like Houston, is an underrated city when compared to NY, LA, and Chicago--but it has everything a young, rich socialite could want. If I'm Melo, I'm taking a good hard look at this option.

    I agree somewhat with the notion that any free agent that is looking to compete for a championship has to look at the West and think, "Man, that s%*t's ridiculous! I think I'll stay over here in the East...."

    Which is why I think Love to Boston is getting more and more likely....which means Rondo probably stays put.....and Melo stays in the East as well. Miami looks real vulnerable right now which means 4-5 teams are all sitting at home thinking, "next season we can take this. We can get to the Finals".

    Which brings up FSS's point about middling free agents. I do like this idea as well. I like the idea of depth and strength at every position. Sefolosha is intriguing, for sure, but I would prefer Afflalo (obviously). It may sound crazy, but I actually wouldn't mind bringing Artest back. I know he is a shell of himself, but his year here in Houston was good--for both parties it seemed--and I think he can bring an edge we are lacking.

    I am still intrigued with Jordan Hamilton--he's got all the tools to be a superb wing defender and offensive contributor....maybe it clicks for him this season if we keep him.

  • feelingsupersonic says 1 month ago So I know most of the discussion here is surrounding big names but I'm starting to think about some minor moves. I know Ariza and Aflalo have been mentioned but what do you all think about Thabo Sefalosha? He can defend 1, 2 and 3's and perhaps his long range shooting benefits from the Rockets offensive schemes. Can his defensive habits and post season experience add something to the Rockets bench? Does he end up turning into a player with something to prove if OKC let's him walk?
  • rocketrick says 1 month ago

    @CT for Three
    I disagree..................Miami's problem is D-Wade is a shell of the player he use to be. how theyaddress that will go a long way in their quest to win more championships. fatigue is also playing a major role. IMO Miami constructed as they are may not win any more championships.

    also............Miami's chances to acquire Melo is a pipe dream. they don't have the cap room to sign himor assets to trade for him. while Melo might be willing to leave some money on the table....the kind of money he would have to leave on the table to join Miami is a deal breaker. there are only 2 teams in the running to really give NY competition for Melo. theyare Houston and Chicago. all other locations either don't have the players to surround Melo or the room to sign him or the assets to trade for him and still maintain enough to win after trading for him. if he truly wants to win above all else we are the clear front runner. while the combination of Rose, Noah and Melolooks good on paper, there are two many questions surrounding Rose and even if Rose stays healthy that team still may not be able to getpass Miami. in addition to that Chicago ischeap. they have proven in the past that they are against paying the luxury tax and I don't see that changingin the near future.

    while NY's fate will be better than that of the Lakers after losing their star it won't be by much. cap room means nothing if there are no big name stars to chase. I hear a lot about the FA class of 2015, but if LMA, Love, Melo and the big three in Miami have their fates decided this summer who is left for 2015? the next really good FA class is 2016 when Durrant comes up.


    I would simply add that there is a 3rd team in the running for Carmelo's consideration.

    NY Knicks and Phil Jackson.

    I don't need to say anything else at this moment about that additional possibility as true NBA fans already know the benefits Carmelo would retain by staying in NYC and the historical Madison Square Garden.
  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @CT for Three

    I disagree..................Miami's problem is D-Wade is a shell of the player he use to be. how theyaddress that will go a long way in their quest to win more championships. fatigue is also playing a major role. IMO Miami constructed as they are may not win any more championships.

    also............Miami's chances to acquire Melo is a pipe dream. they don't have the cap room to sign himor assets to trade for him. while Melo might be willing to leave some money on the table....the kind of money he would have to leave on the table to join Miami is a deal breaker. there are only 2 teams in the running to really give NY competition for Melo. theyare Houston and Chicago. all other locations either don't have the players to surround Melo or the room to sign him or the assets to trade for him and still maintain enough to win after trading for him. if he truly wants to win above all else we are the clear front runner. while the combination of Rose, Noah and Melolooks good on paper, there are two many questions surrounding Rose and even if Rose stays healthy that team still may not be able to getpass Miami. in addition to that Chicago ischeap. they have proven in the past that they are against paying the luxury tax and I don't see that changingin the near future.

    while NY's fate will be better than that of the Lakers after losing their star it won't be by much. cap room means nothing if there are no big name stars to chase. I hear a lot about the FA class of 2015, but if LMA, Love, Melo and the big three in Miami have their fates decided this summer who is left for 2015? the next really good FA class is 2016 when Durrant comes up.

  • CT for Three says 1 month ago

    I just read the Grantland article about Game 4 of the Finals last night, and I am convinced that Melo will not go to Miami, and if we put the right package together, Miami would jump at a Bosh-for-Asik deal.

    The Heat's problems are that they cannot play the overwhelming type of defense they used to play because they are getting old, they get horrible PG play, and they have no interior defense. Melo fixes none of that. And signing him will prevent the Heat from actually addressing those issues, so they will be stuck with the same problems and no cap room to solve them.

    Houston might not want to trade Asik to MIA, even for Bosh, but the deal will be there. Asik would fit MIA's needs perfectly. And more importantly, Bosh would be a tremendous asset in our defensive sets. Bosh can guard the LMA's of the world, and he has an 18ft jumper to be reckoned with. Its not the best deal, but I think it is worth considering.

  • thejohnnygold says 1 month ago

    In case anyone missed it, check out this recent article by Zach Lowe on Parsons and the Rockets. The next few months are going to be very interesting.

  • rockets best fan says 1 month ago

    @rocketrick

    that's just it.......I don't see us just dumping Lin and Asik. we will trade them. IMO the Rockets will land one of these players......Melo, Rondo, Love or Lowry.......with the most likely being Melo. which ever of these players we get we will deal directly with the team who holds their bird rights. all have a reason to be interested in a deal.

    NY = don't want to lose Melo for nothing

    Boston = want to cash out Rondo before he can leave next year since they are in rebuild mode

    Minny = need value on Love before he departs

    Toronto = if Lowry leaves will need PG........good possible trade for Lin+ draft pick

    now of these teams Boston and NY have reason to be interested in Asik and Toronto in Lin. the only one who might not be interested in what we have to offer is Minny. that's why I believe of the bunch Love has the longest odds of being acquired by us

  • rocketrick says 2 months ago

    @rocketrick
    I am totally against waiting to make a move because we want to wait for Love to hit UFA. I do not want to waste another year hoping for a better gain that is a crap shoot at best. now is the time. we must make our move now. if we wait it would also mean we will have let Parsons hit UFA and I don't believe that to be in our best interest. Lin and Asik have got to go......they have become dead weight to the forward progress of this team. Lin for his play and Asik for his attitude. I doubt next year options for teamimprovement will match what's on the Rockets plate right now.

    I agree this draft is deep and our possible pick could be valuable. some of he players who will still be available to us at 25 would be intriguing prospects. however we are in win now mode. Yes we must continue to develop prospects, however this is our chance to get a dollar. we can't waste that chance chasingthree quarters hoping it will become a dollar in 3-4 years.


    Fair enough. I too would like to see the Rockets make necessary improvements to the roster this off-season.

    However, simply dumping Asik and Lin and possibly having to attach draft picks to the trades to entice the other team just for the sake of dumping Asik and/or Lin doesn't make total sense to me.

    Keep in mind, both Asik and Lin are in the final year of their contracts and will want to play as well as possible for the next contract both can expect to receive.

    Also, dumping Asik and Lin doesn't automatically mean the Rockets will get "better" players to replace them. It may turn out that one or both may be better than what the Rockets could garner in a trade or through free agency. Moreso with Asik, Lin is more easily replaceable in my view.

    Knowing that the Rockets are likely going to be in luxury tax territory soon, I believe this year's 1st round draft pick on a 3- or 4-year Rookie contract would be beneficial, especially the right player who can contribute right away off the bench. This is an unusually deep draft and it is unlikely to be repeated anytime soon.

    Sure, if the right circumstances arise, I have no doubt Morey and Leslie Alexander will pull the trigger. However, I don't expect to see a fire sale just for the sake of moving Asik and/or Lin unless there is another move that is certain to improve the Rockets.

    3-point shooting and a defensive minded wing to me are the priorities, along with more point guard depth. If Asik is moved, the Rockets will need a quality backup for D12, too.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Rollingwave

    I agree Ariza isn't worth 10mil per........more like 7-8mil per

    @rocketrick

    I am totally against waiting to make a move because we want to wait for Love to hit UFA. I do not want to waste another year hoping for a better gain that is a crap shoot at best. now is the time. we must make our move now. if we wait it would also mean we will have let Parsons hit UFA and I don't believe that to be in our best interest. Lin and Asik have got to go......they have become dead weight to the forward progress of this team. Lin for his play and Asik for his attitude. I doubt next year options for teamimprovement will match what's on the Rockets plate right now.

    I agree this draft is deep and our possible pick could be valuable. some of he players who will still be available to us at 25 would be intriguing prospects. however we are in win now mode. Yes we must continue to develop prospects, however this is our chance to get a dollar. we can't waste that chance chasingthree quarters hoping it will become a dollar in 3-4 years.

  • rocketrick says 2 months ago

    Lin's contract isnt immovable. It all depends on what Morey is asking for. I think part of what makes it difficult is that Morey doesnt want to risk giving Lin up (again) for nothing only to watch him succeed elsewhere (again).

    Here is a (long) list of NBA teams that have the space to take Lin (and Asik).

    -Utah Jazz $29.6 million (less $8.6 for Haywards cap hold)
    -76ers $29 million
    -Suns $28 million (less $6.6 for Bledsoes cap hold)
    -Lakers $28 million
    -Cavs $23.4 million
    -Pistons $22 million (less $8 for Monroe cap hold)
    -Bobcats $19.5
    -Hawks $13.5

    Lin can be moved. Morey needs to suck it up and make a deal. Lin plus this years first round pick and every team in that list above says OK.


    2 points I would like to make. First being that 2014-15 will be the final season for both Asik and Lin if Morey and the Rockets are not able to find a reasonable trade partner. Both can still be valuable contributors to this team for 1 last season if necessary. Who knows, there is a decent chance Kevin Love might not re-sign with a team he gets traded to, like Sacramento for example. It is a risk to wait, but Love could be signed directly from free agency without the Rockets giving away any assets.

    Secondly, with the expanding salary situation for the Rockets roster in the next several seasons, and with this being an especially deep draft, I think the Rockets 1st round pick this year in particular is too valuable to just give away simply to dump salary (Lin). Drafting someone in this deep draft and signing them to a 3- or 4- year rookie contract could be quite beneficial for the Rockets team salary situation. Especially if that draft pick can contribute right away off the bench.
  • RollingWave says 2 months ago

    Let me just say that I would be quite shocked if Ariza gets 10 mill , he might get more than Deng is only because the later's play this year was quite bad.

    Before he started hitting 3s this year, Ariza was widely regarded as an overpaid bust at 8m. lets just keep that in mind. he only started 15 out of 56 games played the year before.

    But it's ok, lets just all believe that the guy who shot 32% from 3 in 555 games over 9 years is suddenly a 40% 3 point shooter for real, while the guys your desperately going to dump will never improve. sounds like a good plan to me.

  • Cooper says 2 months ago The lakers might take a year of Lin they dont really want melo and anyone else isn't good enough for them to sign to a big deal. Plus they really need picks
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @uojoe82

    we agree on the movability of Lin and Asik's contracts, However not all these teams are interested in taking on more salary to acquire assets. some want to add important pieces to their teams as well. in the cases of Phoenix, Cleveland, Pistons, Bobcats and Lakers they are looking more to either resign their own or add impact players. while Asik fits that need for a few Lin does not. teams like Utah, Atlantaand Philly are our best bets to make such a deal if we move in that direction with him.

    A lotdepends on who the Rockets ultimately chase. if it's Melo they will likely try to make a deal with NY first (that route offering the most flexibility). if they chase Rondo or Love they will have to deal with Boston or Minny. the Rockets likely will only deal with one of the cap relief teams if they need to open the cap room prior to player acquisition. that will only happen if they chase a free agent. otherwise they are likely to dealonly with the team who's player they are acquiring. some 3 teams possibilities loom, but those deals are much harder to make.

  • uojoe82 says 2 months ago

    Lin's contract isnt immovable. It all depends on what Morey is asking for. I think part of what makes it difficult is that Morey doesnt want to risk giving Lin up (again) for nothing only to watch him succeed elsewhere (again).

    There are plenty of NBA owners out there that have no issues taking on "bad" salaries if it means making there team better.

    Last year the Warriors traded Biedrins, Jefferson and Rush to the Jazz in return for some first round picks. Those contracts cost the Jazz $20 million last year, and none of those players had a role on the team or were part of there rebuilding efforts. In return the Jazz got the 23rd pick in this years draft and the warriors first pick in the 2017 draft. Maybe the 2017 pick will amount to something but most likely the Warriors arent going to be in the lottery that year so youre looking at a late first round pick again. So lets recap. In order for the Warriors to unload $20 million in cap (so they could sign Iguodola) they only had to give up the first rounder this year (23rd pick) and there first rounder in 2017. So basically 2 late first round picks in order to get Iggy.

    Here is a (long) list of NBA teams that have the space to take Lin (and Asik).

    -Utah Jazz $29.6 million (less $8.6 for Haywards cap hold)

    -76ers $29 million

    -Suns $28 million (less $6.6 for Bledsoes cap hold)

    -Lakers $28 million

    -Cavs $23.4 million

    -Pistons $22 million (less $8 for Monroe cap hold)

    -Bobcats $19.5

    -Hawks $13.5

    This doenst include teams like the Spurs, Heat, and Mavs who have space but are most likely going to re-sign their own star players. The list above is full of teams that are not likely to attract marquee free agents so they all have room for Lin and his $8.3 cap figure.

    And yes I realize that Lin is owed an additional $ 7 million on top of the $8.3 million cap figure but if you really think this amount would deter an owner from trading for Lin than you're crazy. Every NBA team has at least 1 or 2 players they are paying for but who are playing for another team. So I doubt an owner would be concerned with paying an additional $7 million. Luis Scola has been getting paid $4.5 million for the past 2 years and again next year by the Rockets. Thats $13.5 million being paid to a player who plays for another team.

    Lin can be moved. Morey needs to suck it up and make a deal. Lin plus this years first round pick and every team in that list above says OK.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    just because I didn't post don't mean I'm not lurking :lol:

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Journeymany

    you are correct in your assumption I think moving Lin and Asik can be done. it's really not out of reach like you seem to think. both Lin and Asik will be in the last year of their contracts. even though they have balloon payments due their contracts still have value to other teams. the 15 mil Asik will make next year isn't that much off from market value for him. T-Chandler makes almost 15 mil next year and I would say Asik is on par as a player with him, however Asik will only show 8.3 mil against the cap. for a team at or over the luxury tax limit that could spell relief while still getting a quality player. now Lin...........it's gonna cost a little :lol:but can still be done pretty easily. I wrote a post on how movable theseimmovable deals are awhile back. rather than re-hatch that argument it would be wise to read it first. it was called how to trade a 15 mil contract with an 8.3 cap hold

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Ariza and Deng will both be around the $10 million / year mark, Ariza a little more probably and Deng a little less. That's just not gonna happen unless Lin and Asik are both traded for cap space, which I know rbf seems to think can happen, but most people think is somewhere between very and completely unlikely ;)

    Hmmm, I agree that Ariza gets more than Deng....maybe $10M is a little more reasonable--either way, it will be a sizable contract.

    Not sure why you felt compelled to drag RBF's name into this--he hasn't posted here in 5 days--seems a bit unnecessary in regards to making your point. For the record, I do think we can trade Lin and/or Asik in a variety of ways. So I guess you can include me in that next time.

  • Journeymany says 2 months ago

    Ariza and Deng will both be around the $10 million / year mark, Ariza a little more probably and Deng a little less. That's just not gonna happen unless Lin and Asik are both traded for cap space, which I know rbf seems to think can happen, but most people think is somewhere between very and completely unlikely ;)

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    I like the part where it says, "No one knows if Rondo is actually available"....actually, I'm pretty sure it is common knowledge that the Celtic's are weighing their options. Rondo was on the block at the trade deadline and he continues to be so. Unless Ainge can somehow get Kevin Love in Boston this Summer Rondo is being traded. There are zero reasons to keep him in a rebuild mode while King James still has a couple more years of pure dominance in him.

    I don't mean to be a jerk, but the Bledsoe idea is just not going to happen. Phoenix doesn't trade him for spare parts--they have a better PG, they have a SF they like, and they have way better draft picks than our #25. Unless we take them out into the desert, do some peyote, and get them to sign the contract while contemplating the meaning of the universe we aren't getting that trade done.

    Trevor Ariza for 3 years $20M....really? He's Andre Iguodala-lite with a better shot. Iguodala just signed for 4 yrs. $48M. Ariza is getting something close to that deal--believe it. Every team wants a solid 3&D guy if they can't have a star at SF and Ariza is the best available.

    I'm not interested in Deng...I think signing him to anything above a mid-level exception would be a bad move....and some team will definitely sign him for more than that.

    I like Pierce for the same thing--mid-level exception.

    I would only want Frye if we trade D-Mo....and unless it's for a star I think we keep D-Mo....the potential is too good to give up on it just yet.

    I like the way you're thinking with the PG and SF upgrades, but I seriously doubt Bledsoe is available and, unless Morey is willing to offer at least $11M, Ariza will be elsewhere. I think there is a good chance he stays in D.C. They have room to re-sign both Ariza and Gortat.....or make a play for Carmelo.... :o

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Bledsoe is a max player.
  • uojoe82 says 2 months ago

    Move # 1 Get Erik Bledsoe

    Trade Lin, Parsons, and this years #1 Pick to the suns for Erik Bledsoe. To make this work the Suns would need to re-sign Bledsoe and then trade him to the Rockets.

    Why the Rockets do this trade:

    I would rather sign Bledsoe to 4 years $48 Million than give that money to Parsons. Bledsoe is the ideal fit next to Harden. Bledsoe is Patrick Beverley on 'roids. He's also a better offensive player. He could also guard the opposing teams best back court player, something Harden can't. No one knows if Rondo is actually available. Bledsoe is younger and better offensively than Rondo and he doesn't have the personality "quirks" that might conflict with Harden.

    Why the Suns do this trade:

    The Suns have vowed to match any offer for Bledsoe. But the Knicks said the same thing about Lin 2 years ago. Its one thing to say something and its another to actually do it. Bledsoe might not like being PG 1a on the Suns. Yes he gets to start but having to share PG duties with Dragic might not be something Bledsoe wants to do for the next 4-5 years.

    Move #2 Sign FA Trevor Ariza

    Ariza fills the whole left by Chandler Parson (scenario above). Even if the Chandler isn't traded I'd still like to see he Rockets get Ariza. He is the ideal fit for this team. He's a long perimeter defender (Parson's is not a stopper) and he is an above average 3 point shooter. He can also be the small ball 4 if the Rockets go small. Ariza can give you the same production as Parsons on offense and be the defensive stopper the Rockets need on defense at 75% of what Parsons will cost when he hits free agency. Would you rather have Parsons for 4 years $48 million or Ariza for 3 years at $20 million?

    Move #3 Sign FALuol Deng

    This is only if the Rockets can't get Trevor Ariza. Deng is one of the leagues most professional players. He would be a great fit on and off the court for Houston. He has a lot of games under his belt but I think he wants to play for a contender. He is an above average defender and can be a third scoring option. He has no ego so playing with Harden wouldn't be an issue. He is also one of the leagues best conditioned players so maybe some of his conditioning might rub off on Harden. Something that many people missed about the Blazers series was that Harden looked gassed late in games. Harden needs to get in shape. You cant be that tired if your only playing offense.

    Move # 4 Sign FA Paul Pierce

    This is only if the Rockets can't get Ariza or Deng. Pierce brings what the Rockets are lacking, veteran leadership and playoff experience. I guarantee you that if Pierce had been on the court for that last play in game he would've left his man if he saw Lillard running to the ball instead of watching (like Harden).

    Move # 5 Sign FA Channing Frye

    Can play both the 4 and 5. Can be your stretch 4 or backup 5 if Asik is traded. Very good distance shooter. Underrated defender.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    The part where we're giving them away with a 1st round pick and Jones. That's a lot to give up. Esp since Parsons will also leave next year.

    Ah....here's the quote:

    Houston would trade almost anything not named Dwight Howard and James Harden to get at Anthony and they would go all in on a contract too. There has been talk that Houston has offered up Omer Asik and Jeremy Lin in a “give away” trade that could include their draft pick in the first round or a roster player like Terrence Jones to get those salaries off the books.

    The good news is the author says "or" Jones, not "and". If we're talking Asik, Lin and one of Jones/draft pick I think that deal happens 100 times out of 100....I think it happens even if it is both Jones and the pick.

    Asik is a $.50 cent piece--at best. Lin is $.25 and Jones maxes out at $.50 if he hits his ceiling. Our draft pick is more likely to be a $.10 than $1.00. We all know the Golden Rule of trades: any time you can trade 4 quarters for a dollar you do it. That is what this trade is.

    Sure, Asik is a dominant defender and those are nearly as hard to find as $1.00 players, but his offense will always be an achilles heel that is difficult to overlook. Lin may wind up taking the Chauncey Billups route to success, but do we want to wait 4-5 more years for him to "get it"? I LOVE Terrence Jones, and believe we can win with him at the 4....but would I prefer to bolster our odds of success by swapping him for Melo? Y-E-S, YES!

    If this went down, we would have 3 bona fide stars. Yes, they all have faults and their games have been dissected to the nth degree. The reason their games have been dissected so much is that these players actually matter.

    Would it really matter if we have Trevor Ariza, Chandler Parsons, or Nic Batum at Small Forward? No, not really--they are all solid, but not great players. Conversely, would swapping Harden for Klay Thompson, Bradley Beal, Dwayne Wade, Lance Stephenson, Kevin Martin, Joe Johnson, or any 2 guard in the league make us better? (I can hear the collective, "YES!" from all those who think Harden is an over-rated, no-defense, ego-maniac) But, no....the answer is no.

    I'll miss having Asik, Jones, and even Lin on the team, but if it means getting a player like Anthony, Love, or Rondo then I'll just have to enjoy watching them play for someone else.

    Morey has our team set on a course of acquiring stars and putting role players around them. As much as I love the idea of drafting our own guys and watching them develop into a contending team--that's not what we're doing right now.

    We all saw what the loss of Ibaka did to OKC--and he's their third "star". To compete in the West, we either need PG, SF, PF, and our bench to all take a big step forward next season or trade some of them for an established stud. If you're playing the odds I'd say it's pretty clear which path is more likely to lead to success.

    I'm against emptying the cupboard entirely, but we would still have D-Mo, Daniels, Canaan, Covington, Parsons, and Beverley plus the ability to get some good free agents looking for a title shot. That's enough to compete against any team in the league.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago For cap reasons.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago The part where we're giving them away with a 1st round pick and Jones. That's a lot to give up. Esp since Parsons will also leave next year.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Which part disturbed you?

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago This article is disturbing if true. http://www.basketballinsiders.com/nba-am-whats-real-with-kyrie-boozer-and-melo/?utm_source=feedly&utm_reader=feedly&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=nba-am-whats-real-with-kyrie-boozer-and-melo
  • Cooper says 2 months ago

    The cavs had some decent talent this year and didn't sniff the playoffs, Plus Irving couldnt get along with Waiters, can't imagine he'd do well with Harden and Howard.

  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago I will double down on that. Irving looks like fools gold so far and furthermore he has come up in the Eastern Conference and one would think that to be an easier path. Right now he is over valued so that means he is not on Morey's first list of stars to pursue. The longer I think about Irving the more red flags pop up.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    According to bleachereport, he is available and a main target the Rockets should follow. (Irving)

    "Should follow"? I hope not. Sure, there is a lot to like about Irving, but he is going to receive a max contract when this one is up. The problem with that is he hasn't played a healthy season of basketball since high school (that's 4 years running). He is getting to the rim less and less each season. His TS% and eFG% are going down each season despite shooting more and more three pointers. There is also the concern about his defense.

    If Irving is already down-trending, can't stay healthy, and may be a turnstile on defense why on Earth would we want to pursue him and give him max money? Let him be a problem for somebody else.

  • 08huangj says 2 months ago

    According to bleachereport, he is available and a main target the Rockets should follow. (Irving)

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Kyrie might be available.
  • datruth says 2 months ago

    i like that Pau Gasol talk better. Pau is very talented and if you place him with D-12 and Harden.

    That sounds great and maybe back door and still get Rondo.

  • pharmag says 2 months ago

    While I know this is highly unlikely as this many players rarely move in a trade let alone this many all-star players, but it is highly interesting thought and takes care of all the rumored all-stars most likely to move. Boston has plenty of 1st round picks to spare a few to Minny to compensate the loss of Love (say 2014 Brooklyn first and 2015 Philly first). Rockets could throw in their 2015 even if necessary since Minny is only team not getting all-star in trade although Jones has lots of potential.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mpb2kwz

    Minny doesn't get an all-star player, but a promising TJones to replace Love and 2-3 first rounders should be adequate compensation plus they open up some cap space to try to fill holes/upgrade in FA.

    Boston gets 3 guys that could become core guys to the team including a nice complement frontcourt of Asik/Love and can platoon Lin and Bradley at G. Moves Rondo with all-star coming in return, unloads Green's contract, and makes use of Paul Pierce trade exception. Assuming above picks, they still have 2015 Clippers and 2016 & 2017 Brooklyn first rounders.

    Potential line-up based on last years depth:

    PG Lin/Pressly

    SG Bradley/Bayless

    SF Wallace/Johnson/Bogans

    PF Love/Bass

    C Asik/Olynyk

    New York Knicks get a massive upgrade at PG and a serviceable replacement for Melo at the SF position. Potential line-up based on last year's depth chart:

    PG Rondo/Felton

    SG Shumpert/Smith

    SF Green/Hardaway

    PF Stoudemire/Martin

    C Chandler/Tyler

    Rockets are able to move the Lin and Asik contracts and get Melo to play at the PF position. Potential line-ups:

    PG Beverly/Canaan

    SG Harden/Daniels/Hamilton

    SF Parsons/Garcia/Covington

    PF Carmelo/DMo/Covington?

    C Howard/DMo

    Again far-fetched, but I at least found it fun to think about...

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Cooper

    very true, but it's unlikely he will find another GM as stupid as Billy King. however I agree the thought of Ainge sending out Rondo and picks without an incoming star would fall in the category of pipe dream :lol:

  • Cooper says 2 months ago Ainge got 3 first rounders for washed up KG and a year of PP, he isn't going to give up assets with rondo and not have a star coming back.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Harden/Asik for Lebron? It works out well for both teams. Of course it only works if Miami isn't sure LBJ will re-sign.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Memorial Day is earlier than usual this year and already a massive number of Rockets trade possibilities have been floated on these boards.

    What!?!? Where?!?!? :o

    Come on, Rick....this is the "Summer 2014 Trade DiscussionThread"....what did you expect to find in here?

    Trades and free agency are a part of the sport we all enjoy. I'm sorry that our interest in improving our roster has annoyed you. :P

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Journeymany

    Boston is getting Asik, Beverly and Harkless?..........that's fair for Rondo considering asik isa starting caliber center, Beverly is a good player and Harkless has good potential. Rondo only has one year on his deal which should diminish the return that can be gained. if they insisted on draft picks I would walk away from this deal. as for Olynyk..........think D-Mo........they are basically the same player

  • Journeymany says 2 months ago

    @JG

    I like what we are getting in that trade, however based on what we are giving up we shouldn't be sending any draft picks out to either team. if we can get that package without sending draft picks...........I say do it. that would free us to sign Pau Gasol with the mid-level exemption to shore up depth in the front court while using our own draft picks to help fill the SF hole. there are some other scenarios I like better, but I would ok with this trade

    I don't think Boston pulls the trigger without getting draft picks from us or Orlando as they're losing an allstar in Rondo and a guy considered to have a very high upside too in Olynyk - I don't know his game well enough to comment on it, but it seems he's highly rated. Also, Orlando might be looking at drafting Dante Exum, though I can't remember what pick they have.

  • rocketrick says 2 months ago Memorial Day is earlier than usual this year and already a massive number of Rockets trade possibilities have been floated on these boards.
  • 08huangj says 2 months ago

    He doesn't guard anybody anyways....jk

    He played good defense in the last few games of the series...

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    I like what we are getting in that trade, however based on what we are giving up we shouldn't be sending any draft picks out to either team. if we can get that package without sending draft picks...........I say do it. that would free us to sign Pau Gasol with the mid-level exemption to shore up depth in the front court while using our own draft picks to help fill the SF hole. there are some other scenarios I like better, but I would ok with this trade

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    According to 82games.com, Afflalo pretty much split time between SG and SF.

    His PER was 15.0 as a SG and 18.0 as a SF.

    His Opponent PER was 15.7 as a SG and 14.6 as a SF.

    Seems SF suits him better and I wouldn't worry too much about his 14.6 Opp. PER. According to mysynergysports.com, Afflalo is a TERRIBLE defender...but it seems to be a result of getting bombed on from 3-pt. range. He does ok against the pick n roll, but opponents shoot 44% from deep against him--ouch.

    The more I look at his defensive stats the less sure I am about his defense....I haven't really watched him play much--can anyone attest to his defensive abilities? I've only heard he is a solid defender, but the numbers sure aren't backing that up and would Orlando trade him if he were?

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago He doesn't guard anybody anyways....jk
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Harden can play SF it it came to that.
  • txtdo1411 says 2 months ago

    I just got excited about a potential trade for Houston that is entirely plausible--well, as plausible as imaginary trades can be :lol:

    A three way between Houston, Boston, and Orlando. LINK to trade machine

    Houston gets Rondo and Afflalo

    Boston gets Asik and Beverley from Houston and Moe Harkless from Orlando

    Orlando gets Lin and Parsons from Houston and Kelly Olynyk from Boston

    *some draft picks/cash will likely change hands, but nothing too significant

    Why it works:

    Houston gets a pass-first floor general with solid defensive skills who can make everyone around him better and drives to the rim as well as (almost) anyone in the league. Afflalo is a 3 & D SF who is in his prime, has led a team before, but can relax as a 4th option in Houston--the game will seem easy compared to having to be "the man" in Orlando. He shot 42.7% from 3 last season and is on the books for $7.5M. Combined, the two players will run Houston roughly $19.5M. With Rondo, Afflalo, and Howard our defense should show significant overall improvement. Offensively, we should be better and we were already very good

    Boston gets their center in Asik. They get Harkless who is a talent that still needs a little seasoning and can learn behind Jeff Green--until they move him. Beverley gives them the ability to keep, or trade Bradley--as his next contract will not be a cheap one. This gives the Celts some cheap replacement talent in case they decide to ship out Green and not re-sign Bradley while they wait for Gerald Wallace's monster contract to expire.

    Orlando gets a solid PG to replace Jameer Nelson (whose option will not be picked up) and they get the luxury of a 1 year, no commitment audition. If the don't like Lin they get cap space--if they do they can re-sign him. Paired with Oladipo they could be quite a dynamic back court for years to come. Lin's buddy, Parsons, gets to go home and gives Orlando the luxury of trading Tobias Harris--a very lucrative trade chip--or converting him to a solid stretch 4 (at 6' 9" he can do it). Olynyk is a promising C/PF prospect as well--more quality youth for Orlando.

    A starting 5 of Lin, Oladipo, Parsons, Harris, and Vucevic is worth rolling the dice on. This gives them loads of young talent and in a year or two they can decide who to keep while enjoying max cap room--which would put them, more or less, where Houston was just a couple years ago.

    Boston would need a couple of draft picks to sweeten the deal, but they are winning by getting Rondo out of there. He doesn't want to waste the last 3-4 years of his prime in rebuild mode trying to out-pace the Heat, Pacers, Wizards, Raptors, and Detroit if SVG can work his magic. Keeping him on the roster stifles the young guys' growth and would probably not be good for locker room morale.

    Paging Mr. Morey....

    I would love this scenario. We get a legit starting top 5 pg, who should thrive in a read and react offense, and an excellent 3 & D wing in Afflalo. The only question I would have is if Afflalo has enough size to play SF. Admittedly I do not get to watch very many Orlando games, so I don't know if they went with Afflalo at SF at all. We would still have to develop our young PFs, but with a line-up of Rondo-Harden-Afflalo-Howard around them, I would be completely fine with that.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    I just got excited about a potential trade for Houston that is entirely plausible--well, as plausible as imaginary trades can be :lol:

    A three way between Houston, Boston, and Orlando. LINK to trade machine

    Houston gets Rondo and Afflalo

    Boston gets Asik and Beverley from Houston and Moe Harkless from Orlando

    Orlando gets Lin and Parsons from Houston and Kelly Olynyk from Boston

    *some draft picks/cash will likely change hands, but nothing too significant

    Why it works:

    Houston gets a pass-first floor general with solid defensive skills who can make everyone around him better and drives to the rim as well as (almost) anyone in the league. Afflalo is a 3 & D SF who is in his prime, has led a team before, but can relax as a 4th option in Houston--the game will seem easy compared to having to be "the man" in Orlando. He shot 42.7% from 3 last season and is on the books for $7.5M. Combined, the two players will run Houston roughly $19.5M. With Rondo, Afflalo, and Howard our defense should show significant overall improvement. Offensively, we should be better and we were already very good

    Boston gets their center in Asik. They get Harkless who is a talent that still needs a little seasoning and can learn behind Jeff Green--until they move him. Beverley gives them the ability to keep, or trade Bradley--as his next contract will not be a cheap one. This gives the Celts some cheap replacement talent in case they decide to ship out Green and not re-sign Bradley while they wait for Gerald Wallace's monster contract to expire.

    Orlando gets a solid PG to replace Jameer Nelson (whose option will not be picked up) and they get the luxury of a 1 year, no commitment audition. If the don't like Lin they get cap space--if they do they can re-sign him. Paired with Oladipo they could be quite a dynamic back court for years to come. Lin's buddy, Parsons, gets to go home and gives Orlando the luxury of trading Tobias Harris--a very lucrative trade chip--or converting him to a solid stretch 4 (at 6' 9" he can do it). Olynyk is a promising C/PF prospect as well--more quality youth for Orlando.

    A starting 5 of Lin, Oladipo, Parsons, Harris, and Vucevic is worth rolling the dice on. This gives them loads of young talent and in a year or two they can decide who to keep while enjoying max cap room--which would put them, more or less, where Houston was just a couple years ago.

    Boston would need a couple of draft picks to sweeten the deal, but they are winning by getting Rondo out of there. He doesn't want to waste the last 3-4 years of his prime in rebuild mode trying to out-pace the Heat, Pacers, Wizards, Raptors, and Detroit if SVG can work his magic. Keeping him on the roster stifles the young guys' growth and would probably not be good for locker room morale.

    Paging Mr. Morey....

  • 08huangj says 2 months ago

    In an espn insider article posted today outlining the other 29 NBA teams' "trade chips" in a potential Kevin Love deal, Amin Elhassan wrote this about the Rockets:

    Trade bait: James Harden, Omer Asik, Jeremy Lin, Terrence Jones, Troy Daniels

    Pitch: Houston will sell the Wolves on Harden being the only All-NBA player dangled in an offer, along with an elite defensive big in Asik and any other selection from the end of the roster. Like Golden State, the Rockets' strength is they can give up proven talent to help Minnesota win in the present. Unlike Golden State, Houston can throw in a combination of first-rounders moving forward. In this scenario, Love plays alongside a dominant defensive big in Howard and plays for the man who drafted and coached him in Kevin McHale.

    Is it possible the Rockets could consider moving Harden for another top 15 player?

    Sorry, but I think that the probability of this trade is less than a Hamilton-for-LeBron scenario. I wouldn't do the trade even if our trade bait was only James Harden. He's a little better than Love in my opinion.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    my line of think in having Lowry #2 is...........it also gives us flexibility to obtain another impact player. I agree Love is better, but I like Lowry better. he's one favorite players. I also would prefer him to Rondo

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @thenit

    totally agree. the chance of that happening are slim and none and slim called in sick.

    @spikey11mikey

    WELCOME TO THE FORUM :)this just shows how little espn really knows about the Rockets thought process.......they couldn't befurther off base if they were trying. we aren't trying to exchange stars......we're trying to add a third one

  • Cooper says 2 months ago

    Harden is a little better than love plus theres almost no young impact shooting guards.

  • thenit says 2 months ago Sorry but that would only happen if minny kidnaps morey's family and threatens to kill them would that trade happen. Harden and Asik for love will never happen.
  • spikey11mikey says 2 months ago In an espn insider article posted today outlining the other 29 NBA teams' "trade chips" in a potential Kevin Love deal, Amin Elhassan wrote this about the Rockets:

    Trade bait: James Harden, Omer Asik, Jeremy Lin, Terrence Jones, Troy Daniels

    Pitch: Houston will sell the Wolves on Harden being the only All-NBA player dangled in an offer, along with an elite defensive big in Asik and any other selection from the end of the roster. Like Golden State, the Rockets' strength is they can give up proven talent to help Minnesota win in the present. Unlike Golden State, Houston can throw in a combination of first-rounders moving forward. In this scenario, Love plays alongside a dominant defensive big in Howard and plays for the man who drafted and coached him in Kevin McHale.

    Is it possible the Rockets could consider moving Harden for another top 15 player?
  • Cooper says 2 months ago

    Id be cool with taking wallace if it means giving up less for rondo, with rondo and assuming they keep parsons thats pretty much capped out regardless.

    Trading parsons for a pick is too risky right now, if the pick flops morey gets canned. He will want a sure thing back for his best remaining trade piece.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    What about Morey making the decision that Parsons isn't worth keeping at 12 per.(around that is his expected salary 8-12). Why not package Parasons/Asik/ 2 firsts for that 8 pick. We could get Smart as our starting PG or if Exum falls or go after our PF if Gordon/Randle/Vonleh fall. They want to go for the playoffs and getting Asik while moving DMC back to PF and grabbing a wing like parsons might be worth it. What do you think? SA did it with Kawhi so it's not a mistake for contenders to grab youth while they can.

    I see your logic, but wholly disagree with you. We are not in position to make that sort of move--I still think moving Parsons is tricky and can only be done in a few ways....that is not one of those ways. Dwight wants to win and win now--any trade of his buddy, Parsons, for a building block and not a significant positional upgrade would not make the big man happy.

    This ship's course has been set for the next 4 years or so. Towards the end of that I think we can start looking to make those kinds of moves, but right now it's about trying to out-muscle the other Western Powers.

    San Antonio was fortunate to have extra quality PG's laying around--one of which Indiana wanted, and they just happened to have too many studly SF's laying around. Those situations don't happen very often. We don't have anyone to back-up Parsons at SF....plus, what do we do with the PG position? Play the rookie?

    I like the idea of acquiring young talent so that we can re-stock on the fly for years to come--and I think Morey is working on that. First, we need to establish the foundation of the team and build from there. We're not quite there yet.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    @JG

    I agree we can't go wrong with any of these guys(Don't leave out Lowry) I prefer to have them in this order

    1. Carmelo

    2. Lowry

    3. Love

    4. Rondo

    I'm not nearly as high on Lowry as you are--he is a 3 pt. bomber with standard PG skills--his passing and penetration don't wow me. The defense is good. Still, he might not even be my 4th favorite option for free agency this year--he is more of the same. We need a new ingredient in this casserole we're making--we've got the meat, vegetables, and noodles....now we need the sauce to bring it all together.

    Here is his highlight video:

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago What about Morey making the decision that Parsons isn't worth keeping at 12 per.(around that is his expected salary 8-12). Why not package Parasons/Asik/ 2 firsts for that 8 pick. We could get Smart as our starting PG or if Exum falls or go after our PF if Gordon/Randle/Vonleh fall. They want to go for the playoffs and getting Asik while moving DMC back to PF and grabbing a wing like parsons might be worth it. What do you think? SA did it with Kawhi so it's not a mistake for contenders to grab youth while they can.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Would you still want Rondo if they insisted on us taking Wallace?

    That's really tough.... :unsure:

    Wallace isn't completely useless--he's just useless compared to that $10M price tag for 2 more seasons.

    One way of looking at it is Rondo, at $13M + Wallace at $10 = Anthony at $23-24M. So, the money is the same and we get 2 players.

    If we take Wallace then I'd say Parsons is off the table as well as a couple other assets--you don't get to screw us both ways. You can either have some of our goodies, or we'll take your junk--not both.

    As a potential back-up, he can run the floor and still play decent defense against SF's. (It makes me sick just thinking about it for this long)

    If he comes in, It's only two years and we don't have to play him. We're still over the cap either way so it only hurts us luxury tax-wise and only for two years. If it means getting an elite passing PG--I'd say you do it because they don't grow on trees. Assuming the above statement about keeping most of our youth is true, we could bundle him with some talent to a re-building team that needs to hit the minimum cap while adding youth, etc....it's not the end of the world.

    Short version: I'd do it, but I wouldn't like it....and I would immediately start trying to get rid of him.

  • rocketrick says 2 months ago

    @JG
    I agree we can't go wrong with any of these guys(Don't leave out Lowry) I prefer to have them in this order
    1. Carmelo
    2. Lowry
    3. Love
    4. Rondo


    I understand the quandary between Carmelo and Kevin Love although I seriously doubt it will come down to a simple decision in Houston as to which of the 2 to target because one, if not both, will commit elsewhere no matter what.

    But Lowry over Love in your pecking order? Mmmm, makes no sense to me at all.

    Lowry was like my most favorite Rockets player after 2009 as I expected T-Mac and Yao to go off gently into that night.

    However, the Rockets as configured today are much different than at that time. Kevin Love easily in my mind is the more valuable player between the 2 as he must rely on other teammates to create the open 3 for him to shoot. Lowry most definitely has to have the ball in his hands and that is not going to work with Harden and D12 on the roster as well.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    I agree we can't go wrong with any of these guys(Don't leave out Lowry) I prefer to have them in this order

    1. Carmelo

    2. Lowry

    3. Love

    4. Rondo

  • rocketrick says 2 months ago

    The Lakers have a lottery pick. So do the Celtics. There are teams that he wants to go to that have lottery picks.


    Ouch, those lottery picks don't seem so great today, do they?
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    NO....... Wallace is a non-starter for me. I suspect if we were willing to accept Wallace, Rondo would already be in Houston. if Lin's contract is a rock........Wallace's is like being chained to a bolder :lol:

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Would you still want Rondo if they insisted on us taking Wallace?
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    With so much talk about Love versus Anthony I thought I'd post some highlight videos to give us an idea of what we'd potentially be getting from adding each player. To begin, I'd like to start with my preference--Rajon Rondo :)

    This video is 11 minutes of his 2013-14 highlights--so set aside a little time. What you'll see is an ideal PG for the "read and react" offense we employ. He attacks relentlessly, can finish at the rim, can lead the fast break, bends the defense, and delivers pinpoint passes that, most importantly, are catch-able. Check out his passes into the post and imagine Dwight feasting off of that. Remember, he's working with Kris Humphries, Gerald Wallace, Sullinger, and Olynyk as his bigs.

    His defense is solid for a PG and this guy would transform our team on both ends of the floor. He's tough, experienced, and makes everyone around him better. Bonus, he's on the cheapest contract of the 3, could attract Paul Pierce to come in on the cheap, and is probably the easiest to acquire via trade as Ainge wants Asik.

    Next is Carmelo Anthony. After watching this 15 minute video of highlights from this season I realized that he is Paul Pierce 2.0: Bigger, Stronger, Faster, Better. Carmelo will be 30 years old and entering his 11th NBA season....Paul Pierce didn't win until his 10th NBA season...after teaming up with 2 other studs....at the age of 30 :o

    The guy can flat out score the rock. Contact doesn't bother him--he is actually a pretty physical player. He can get a shot off with zero space. He is effective from deep, mid, in the post, as a cutter, spot-up, and probably doing cartwheels down the lane. He's not Lebron or Magic with the rock, but he can make good passes when he wants to.

    More than anything, he would come in and give us another option to close out games late. Sometimes, you just need a bucket and he is a guy, like Pierce was for Boston, who can keep an opponent at arms reach down the stretch by putting the ball in the hole.

    It does look like he has lost a step speed-wise and off his vertical, but Pierce had the same thing happen to him and it worked out just fine. Of the 3 options, he is my #2 choice.

    Lastly, we have Kevin Love. We know about his outlet passing. We know about the rebounding--particularly on the offensive glass and in traffic. We know he is a legitimate stretch 4 who possesses both the height, bulk, and skill to match-up with anyone. He would provide another solid pick n roll partner with the bonus that he can float up for the pick n pop...something we haven't really had in a while. We know he has a beard.

    At 25 years old he still has room for improvement and lots of miles left on the odometer. He has shown the ability to add new elements to his game and plays well with others. As a part of a "Big 3" he would definitely be a solid contributor.

    this link is giving me trouble. Click HERE if it isn't loading.

    Let your imaginations wander and picture each playing alongside Harden and Howard (can't be certain who else will be here if one of these trades go through) each bringing a unique skill set and quality to the team. There is no wrong answer, really.

    I will go back to my Rondo preference. We all know he will make Howard and Harden's lives easier (I don't subscribe to the Harden can't play off the ball business). Where I see him really making a difference is with Terrence Jones. Jones, in my opinion, will show up with a better jumper and better feel for the game next season (and hopefully some better defense). His off-ball movement and cutting combined with Rondo will create nightly highlight reels.

    It's funny, Rondo used to be one of my least favorite players. As time has passed, I have acquired a taste for him and his style of play. I think he is just what the doctor ordered for this Rockets team.

  • datruth says 2 months ago

    I agree with most of you guys.

    This is D-12 team now.

    I think that's attractive piece for recruitment.

    D-12 is dominant big man and it's debatable the best in the league at his position..

    Who gives effort on both ends of the floor.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago The Lakers have a lottery pick. So do the Celtics. There are teams that he wants to go to that have lottery picks.
  • Steven says 2 months ago No team will give up a lottery pick for one year of Love. He holds all the power, for he can tell any team, I am not signing an extension now or next summer. He will end up in one of the 3-5 places he thinks is best for himself.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    I agree..........we can do a trade with NY because they are over the barrel with Melo, but Minny is in no such situation. they have time with Love and considering some of the teams that will be in the bidding our max offer comes up a little short. now if Love demands to come here that changes everything and that is a possibility, but outside of that I don't see it. they are not interested in what we have to offer.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago With lottery picks being shopped I don't see how we have enough.
  • bernardo says 2 months ago

    Adrian Wojnarowski: Another contender planning aggressive play for a Kevin Love trade, sources tell Yahoo: Houston. Kevin McHale has strong bond with Love.

    Love is the perfect guy to pair up with Dwight. I'm not seeing how, but we should definetely try to bring him along. It would be a deadly frontcourt.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    So what does everyone think about Kevin Love? Can we realistically fashion a trade for him? Will Minnesota fold or play hardball with him? (Surely they have to make a deal--the question is when?)

    They've got money tied up in Pekovic, Rubio, Martin, Shved, Brewer, Budinger, Mbah a Moute....their roster is a bit of a mess.

    We would have to send a king's ransom to get him--plus probably need a third team as they probably don't want Lin or Asik. Would Atlanta send Horford to Minnesota for T-Jones and Asik?

    There are going to be a lot of bidders on this one and one team I think is being over-looked is Philadelphia. I fully expect Hinkie to roll out a solid offer.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    I love Rondo, I think he is one of the most unique players I have every seen. I have watched his whole career because I loved those KG, Pierce Allen Celtics. My two concerns is the Personality Mix and Spacing.

    I think the Rockets need that a-hole that holds everybody accountable, and Rondo is that guy. How will Howard and Harden react to that? How will Harden feel that the Rockets didn't let him grow into a leader? He's only 24.

    Kobe and Rondo have similar personalities, and we all know that didn't work.

    The Spacing issue isn't due to Rondo's midrange jump shot. His midrange has steadily improved. (Look Up Goldsberry's Chart on Rondo) Rondo is ball dominant and like Harden, they both just stand there when they don't have the ball. Harden is less of an issue because he is a proficient 3 point shooter but Rondo, he can't shoot the three.

    What are your thoughts on the Personality Combo? Howard-Harden-Rondo= POISON

    I have none of these concerns. First, if Rondo comes here it won't be his team. This team became Dwight's during that Portland series. It will remain Dwight's team until he says otherwise--and I do think he will pass that torch when the time comes.

    Rondo was never the leader during the KG, Pierce, Allen days--KG did most of that.

    I don't really know what your sentence about Kobe and whatever not working is about.

    Harden gets painted like he has the psyche of a fragile 13 year old that constantly needs the approval of others. Which is weird because he does not give off any such aura to me.

    How will he react to "not being allowed to grow into a leader"? This question is so strange....what precludes him from growing into a leader? Did you read the article I posted? Rondo is 28. He is entering his prime (assuming his health is good) along with Dwight. Those two should be perfect role models for Harden that allow him to grow into being a leader over time--nobody is stifling him.

    This video encapsulates my feelings every time somebody starts talking about players' feelings (sorry, it is a commercial...but it is spot on to how I feel about this).

    Ball-dominance. Another thing that is always brought up. Why? Last I checked Rondo was able to do quite well with 3 other stars on the floor. James Harden is "ball-dominant" because that is what the team asks of him. When he does speak to media, he often refers to this. He is doing his best to learn his role and do the things the team needs him to do--he's learning his Kenny Rogers "Gambler" routine, except it's that he's got to know when to get others involved and when to take over himself.

    Now, imagine a world where we alleviate half of that burden from our guy, Mr. Harden, and put it into the hands of a guy who LIVES for that stuff and is better at it. Rondo doesn't want to score 30 points....if he did he would have practiced shooting more growing up. He wants to break down the defense and find open shooters. People talk about finding skill sets that fit well together--how about an elite passer/penetrator, an elite shooter/slashing scorer, and an elite big man who can finish with the best of them surrounded by Parsons, Jones, D-Mo, Daniels, Lin (maybe), etc. depending on the matchups.

    I am not concerned about personality issues. Nobody knows what these guys are actually like--we only see them on TV and very few people are 100% themselves when they know they are being filmed.

    As far as "poison" chemistry....where does this comes from? Let's take a look at actual facts. It is well known that Josh Smith and Dwight are close friends from their high school days....you know who Smith played his senior year of high school ball with? Rondo. I'd say that bridge can easily be crossed. Rondo played at Kentucky with Chuck Hayes--that can't hurt, right?....plus T-Jones and Rondo share that UK connection. I don't understand why there is a concern over poison anything. Oh, right.....

    geicotherapistthrowingkleenexbox.jpg

    Believe me, Rondo's agent will let Morey know if he doesn't want to come here. Harden and Howard will be consulted on this as well. If they aren't all excited about it then it won't get done.

    This team can use a guy like Rondo--they're too nice....we need someone who, when he gives that "intimidating" stare-down to an opposing player it is actually intimidating because the other person's not sure if they're about to get punched, stabbed, shot, or worse. Rondo--he can do that. Harden and Howard...eh, not so much. Definitely not Parsons or Lin.

  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    I love Rondo, I think he is one of the most unique players I have every seen. I have watched his whole career because I loved those KG, Pierce Allen Celtics. My two concerns is the Personality Mix and Spacing.

    I think the Rockets need that a-hole that holds everybody accountable, and Rondo is that guy. How will Howard and Harden react to that? How will Harden feel that the Rockets didn't let him grow into a leader? He's only 24.

    Kobe and Rondo have similar personalities, and we all know that didn't work.

    The Spacing issue isn't due to Rondo's midrange jump shot. His midrange has steadily improved. (Look Up Goldsberry's Chart on Rondo) Rondo is ball dominant and like Harden, they both just stand there when they don't have the ball. Harden is less of an issue because he is a proficient 3 point shooter but Rondo, he can't shoot the three.

    What are your thoughts on the Personality Combo? Howard-Harden-Rondo= POISON

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Well, well, well....Looks like Danny Ainge is putting some polish on Rondo. This interview has him gushing about how great Rondo is going to be next season. That's all good and well. What I really liked was later in the interview where he talks about leadership, player development, and player faults. I think some of that perspective would be useful when looking at our own team.

    Love him or hate him, when healthy he might be one of the few PG's in the league that could go toe-to-toe with Russell Westbrook, Chris Paul, Damian Lillard, Steph Curry, and Tony Parker--on both ends of the floor. When considering our path to the finals it seems inevitable that at least 2 of those guys will stand in our way every year.

    Like Ainge said, he has his faults. However, he also said guys like him who can show up, under the bright spotlights of the playoffs, and be the best player on the floor for a series are hard to find. On his own, he's not a world beater....surround him with talent and that changes. In Houston, that would be the situation--If Morey can get him without giving up the farm I think he does it.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Cooper/ JG

    Henson is a second year player like T-Jones. he has a higher ceiling than T-Jones because he possesses one thing T-Jones doesn't.....wingspan. the man is built like a gorilla :lol:this makes him a much better defensive player + he has a better low post game than T-Jones. I agree JG he does need a little more sand in the pants, but he is a 21year old kid who still has some filling out to do. I remember when people use to say the same about KG. I'm not saying the kid is the next coming of KG, but he does have star potential.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    He's got some good skills and qualities, but I think he's too slight to withstand the punishment he'll take at PF....he will wind up hurt more often than not.

  • Cooper says 2 months ago I watched maybe 2 bucks games this year but couldn't say I'm very impressed by Henson.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    I'm very surprised you've got Henson at #3. I'd love to get Tucker...depending on the cost.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Matt Maloney's Ghost

    I think there is little chance Morey chases Williams. the rumor was at the deadline this year Morey could have made that deal.....the Nets were willing to talk, but we backed off after getting a look at medical reports on his ankles. I doubt we would revisit that. I'd have to disagree on Melo...simply to good to pass on. Rondo is more like plan C in my eyes, but I would still take him. my hope is the Rockets pursue upgrades in this order

    1.Melo 6.Affalo

    2.Lowry7.PJ-Tucker

    3.J-Henson 8.A-Bradley

    4.Rondo 9.P-Gasol

    5.Love 10.G-Green

    I didn't list Lebron, Wade and Bosh because I don't believeany will leave Miami

  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    According to Hoopshype,

    Deron Williams in on the market. Don't Do It Morey!

  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    @Rockets Best Fan

    I know, I know, but I would at least make the call.

    As a fan, if we gave San Antonio the Brooklyn Deal, (3 first round picks + whatever player like Parsons and Jones, any rights that we have with foreign players) for Leonard, I would be ok with it.

    I bet San Antonio would think about it.

    The more I think about it, we have to trade Parsons to get something great.

    Trading Asik or Lin will get us B- versions of each player.

    I'm not interested in Melo or Rondo, unless Melo is willingly to take a pay cut.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Matt Maloney's Ghost

    the only way to get Kawhi out of San Antonio is via kidnapping and I recommend against that :lol:I agree with CT for Three that San Antonio's front officeis well aware of what they have in Leonard. 0% chance they trade him or let him go

  • Cooper says 2 months ago

    That said, there is -100% chance that SA makes that trade because their front office is such a good talent evaluator; so they see Leonard's upside better than Penny from The Big Bang Theory. I actually think Morey will invest in Parsons. He can play decent defense against 3s and slow 2s (usually) and his offense gels with Harden and Howard perfectly. I think the Hair and the Beard need to spend time this offseason learning how they can complement each other better in crunch time. Harden loves that iso, but if he and Parsons can get a 2 man game going down the stretch of close games, who is going to guard them? Both can drive, cut and shoot the 3 at a decent clip. It can keep the offense flowing even with the ball in Harden's hands.

    I think a better target for trade discussion is Mason Plumlee from the Nets. He is a decent defender, with the length to give trouble to the LMAs of the world, and possibly give Dwight a breather from time to time. He is not an the optimal "3 and D" PF that we would like, but at this point I would settle for just the D(efense, didnt wanna leave myself open on the Internet like that). And the Nets are one of the few teams that actually might consider absorbing one of the Lin/Asik albatross contracts. Asik would be a good fit for BK: goes to a contender in the East, plays against weak center competition in the East, would be playing with guys who want to slow the tempo down... The Rox would get another promising big with good length and athleticism, get to pass Asik off to an Eastern Conf. team which would limit the chance of Asik improving a rival, and Plumlee's contract will leave room for another max guy, potentially (assuming we can deal Lin.)

    The nets will have lopez next year, Proks loves handing out checks but 30mill+ into the center position plus KG may or may not be back would push that even higher. Plumlees a nice player though maybe we could get him for a pick which the nets are in desperate need of.

  • CT for Three says 2 months ago

    Trade Parsons, Terrence Jones, and Draft Picks, and whatever the Spurs want for Kawhi Leonard. Overpay for Leonard!

    I know I know I'm crazy but I would at least make a call. I love Leonard. We drafted MARCUS MORRIS instead.

    PAIN!

    PAIN!

    And I live in San Diego, so I watched him play a lot.

    That said, there is -100% chance that SA makes that trade because their front office is such a good talent evaluator; so they see Leonard's upside better than Penny from The Big Bang Theory. I actually think Morey will invest in Parsons. He can play decent defense against 3s and slow 2s (usually) and his offense gels with Harden and Howard perfectly. I think the Hair and the Beard need to spend time this offseason learning how they can complement each other better in crunch time. Harden loves that iso, but if he and Parsons can get a 2 man game going down the stretch of close games, who is going to guard them? Both can drive, cut and shoot the 3 at a decent clip. It can keep the offense flowing even with the ball in Harden's hands.

    I think a better target for trade discussion is Mason Plumlee from the Nets. He is a decent defender, with the length to give trouble to the LMAs of the world, and possibly give Dwight a breather from time to time. He is not an the optimal "3 and D" PF that we would like, but at this point I would settle for just the D(efense, didnt wanna leave myself open on the Internet like that). And the Nets are one of the few teams that actually might consider absorbing one of the Lin/Asik albatross contracts. Asik would be a good fit for BK: goes to a contender in the East, plays against weak center competition in the East, would be playing with guys who want to slow the tempo down... The Rox would get another promising big with good length and athleticism, get to pass Asik off to an Eastern Conf. team which would limit the chance of Asik improving a rival, and Plumlee's contract will leave room for another max guy, potentially (assuming we can deal Lin.)

  • bladad says 2 months ago

    Trade Parsons, Terrence Jones, and Draft Picks, and whatever the Spurs want for Kawhi Leonard. Overpay for Leonard!

    I know I know I'm crazy but I would at least make a call. I love Leonard. We drafted MARCUS MORRIS instead.

    PAIN!

    PAIN!

    And I live in San Diego, so I watched him play a lot.

    He is so good. He guards the toughest cover almost all the time. Can shoot the 3, can slash to the basket, and i'm sure is waiting for his coming out party. Trade Parsons and TJones and the Rockets become a serious contender in the west based on the balance of offense and defense of the starting 5. Assuming Bev is still the starter next year.

  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    Trade Parsons, Terrence Jones, and Draft Picks, and whatever the Spurs want for Kawhi Leonard. Overpay for Leonard!

    I know I know I'm crazy but I would at least make a call. I love Leonard. We drafted MARCUS MORRIS instead.

    PAIN!

    PAIN!

    And I live in San Diego, so I watched him play a lot.

  • Cooper says 2 months ago Cannan has to play a little tougher role, handling the ball more. As long as Daniels can hit 3s in the mid 40% he has a spot in the league.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @rocketrick

    I agree the early returns have Daniels out front, but I don't believe we have really seen enough of either to make the call yet.

  • rocketrick says 2 months ago

    @TTDN
    Asik = had a bad year. if he had focused instead of allowing his personal situation get in the way he would have been higher. he has the talent level to play above scrub status

    Beverly = is a bench player at best. a specialty player. possesses a superior skill. because his skill is defense his flaws are easier to hide. useful scrub

    D-Mo = scrub typical European soft defenseless big man.

    Garcia = scrub, but useful scrub

    Canaan = rookie who saw little real playing time........the jury is still out

    I would be the first to say we need an upgrade at PG. Asik proved his value last year. I like all these players except Lin, but that doesn't mean I have rose colored glasses on when it comes to evaluating their talent. some may excel because of their fit here, but none are good (except Asik)enough to be counted on as a starter unless the fit is perfect with the other players in the starting lineup.


    Troy Daniels Clearly Better than the Cannon guy. My Opinion Only.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    Asik = had a bad year. if he had focused instead of allowing his personal situation get in the way he would have been higher. he has the talent level to play above scrub status

    Beverly = is a bench player at best. a specialty player. possesses a superior skill. because his skill is defense his flaws are easier to hide. useful scrub

    D-Mo = scrub typical European soft defenseless big man.

    Garcia = scrub, but useful scrub

    Canaan = rookie who saw little real playing time........the jury is still out

    I would be the first to say we need an upgrade at PG. Asik proved his value last year. I like all these players except Lin, but that doesn't mean I have rose colored glasses on when it comes to evaluating their talent. some may excel because of their fit here, but none are good (except Asik)enough to be counted on as a starter unless the fit is perfect with the other players in the starting lineup.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Okay. So you base your evaluations of players on PER.

    Asik = Scrub
    Beverley = Scrub
    DMo = Scrub
    Garcia = Scrub
    Canaan = Scrub

    I agree that all of those guys need to be gone.
  • Steven says 2 months ago

    @TTDN
    now we're discussing different levels of scrubness? :blink: :lol: let me clear the air here. when I call Lin a scrub that doesn't mean I think he is useless. in previous post discussing him I have made a case for all the reasons between his contract, streaky play, fit with this team and physical limitations that Lin is not a good player or good deal for the Rockets. My designation for scrub is any player below 15 PER. now if you want to get into levels of scrubness your on your own. Lin isn't just a scrub......he's an expensive scrub :lol:

    Is your scrubness, like the 6 levels of fatness?
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    now we're discussingdifferent levels of scrubness? :blink: :lol:let me clear the air here. when I call Lin a scrub that doesn't mean I think he is useless. in previous post discussing him I have made a case for all the reasons between his contract, streaky play, fit with this team and physical limitations that Lin is not a good player or good deal for the Rockets. My designation for scrub is any player below 15 PER. now if you want to get into levels of scrubness your on your own. Lin isn't just a scrub......he's an expensive scrub :lol:

  • Steven says 2 months ago

    I understand that RBF but when you call Lin a scrub it makes you seem extremely irrational. A scrub is Austin Rivers his rookie year or Bennett. Lin is an overpaid streaky sixth man IMO. Moving his salary to obtain a superstar is good business. Moving him for nothing is dumb. Unless management believes in Canaan that much, it makes sense to keep Lin.

    I believe in Canaan that much. Morey has no problems trading people to open up spots for players.

    RBF is a bit over enthusiastic with his words about Lin, but his point is still there, Lin is an below average point guard, the stats prove it.

    And if the Rockets were to trade Lin for basically nothing, it isn't nothing if the Rockets use the cap space to sign a "terrific free agent".
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago I understand that RBF but when you call Lin a scrub it makes you seem extremely irrational. A scrub is Austin Rivers his rookie year or Bennett. Lin is an overpaid streaky sixth man IMO. Moving his salary to obtain a superstar is good business. Moving him for nothing is dumb. Unless management believes in Canaan that much, it makes sense to keep Lin.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    that's the thing about averages...........they hide streakiness. as for the answer to your earlier question. Yes I prefer a player with more consistency than a player with more explosiveness who is less consistent. if I know what I'm getting every night it's easier to build around.

  • Steven says 2 months ago In the stat that matters most, PER (it combines everything), Crawford was a full 20% better then Lin. 20%!

    That's saying 25 and 30 homers are close. 100 and 120 RBIs are close. And ERA of 2.5 and 3.0 are close. They aren't close. Close is a rounding error.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Every team runs ISOs, derp.... but it would seem the Rockets are one of the teams that

    1) run it more often
    2) run it to the detriment of the rest of the offense

    Howard / Melo / Harden / McHale

    Great on *paper..........*

    Could probably even enough games to put them in upper 50s, challenge for first seed in the West. I think they would get to the Western Finals at best.

    McHale can barely get these guys to buy in now, throw in Melo. The guy who after a complete NBA season didn't play himself to shape, and lost another 15 pounds before the Olympics. The guy bitching about playing the 4 under Mike D, then goes around and has his best season running the four under his new company man coach.

    I think the Rockets need a leader, an elite leader. There's only so many of those. But look who is left in the playoffs, and think about who really has a chance to win.

    OKC
    LAC
    SAS
    MIA

    IND

    Welcome, biggajiggafigga. You mentioned that you are getting used to this forum (primarily in how the posting system works) so please allow me to help you in some of our etiquette.

    First, it helps to understand who you are responding to by using the quote function. It will automatically open a text box with the quote inside. In this way, when you respond to my post at the top of the page people will realize it is me you are calling a "derp".

    Which brings me to my next point. We don't do name-calling of any kind here--even when it's new words that most over the age of 35 don't even know. If you want to disagree with someone feel free, but please refrain from making things personal with insults and name-calling. That is not up to our standards here.

    It's fine to want the Rockets' offense to evolve--and it will. These other teams you mention have all gone through what we are going through now (In Indiana's case I think they are on par with us).

    There is a quote by William Faulkner in his book, The Reivers, that says, "a boy doesn't become a man until a man is needed". Look at our roster, and try to empathize and understand that they are going through their own rites of passage--personally and as a whole. Criticize them if you like, but it won't change anything.

    There is another quote from that same book, "Your outside is just what you live in, sleep in, and has little connection with who you are and even less with what you do". I like this and I think it pertains to this discussion.

    We judge these players, these people, from their outsides. We judge them under a microscope, based on a few hours of their time, when they are caught up in intense competition, always knowing they are on camera, and find ourselves qualified to rule over the entirety of their being. I haven't taken even one step in their shoes--let alone walked a mile. All I can do is relate my life experience to theirs. For me, I didn't become a useful human being until after I had plumbed the depths of my own foolishness. Watching others do so is a gentle reminder that we all have so much to learn and that we all deserve patience from others.

    I don't mean to get all philosophical. I'm just trying to illustrate my perspective. I believe in these guys and am happy to watch them grow up. I know they are not perfect and I can only hope that, like me, they find a deeper, better, stronger part of themselves as they struggle to learn to win. That's a big part of what makes life, sports, or whatever interesting to me.

    You say the Rockets need a leader--implying we do not have one. Do you have anyone in mind? Is it a player? A coach? Both? I agree that leaders are important and would like to know who you like for our team.

  • BrentYen says 2 months ago No, I think consistency is the difference between great and good, if you are talking about Lin.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Good point. But isn't that what averages are for? Or would you like to have the data have standard deviations from that mean and see who's more consistent?

    What's considered good?
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    consistency is the difference between good and mediocre. anybody can have a flash. good players do it every night

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Not efficient I meant consistent.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago So you would rather a leaser player who is more efficient? I think with a full offseason to improve on things that a sixth man should bring to the table he will be more consistent this coming year. He improved from last year. I see an upward trend. But I will agree to disagree.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    this is where stats can fool you. their stats may be close, but Crawford is a more steady player whereas Lin is more streaky. when Lin is hot...he's red hot. when he's cold he's ice cold. Crawford produces way more consistently

  • biggajiggafigga says 2 months ago

    SORRY ABOUT ALL THE EXTRA POSTS

    Indiana - pretenders, they won't be Detroit Pistons of 2004. As far as I recall, they were much more bought in to their team. No superstars, and a spread of four so so all stars, but they had Rasheed and Ben Wallace to rally around.

    Still getting use to this board, and it's there are errors showing up when I try to post.

  • biggajiggafigga says 2 months ago

    Every team runs ISOs, derp.... but it would seem the Rockets are one of the teams that

    1) run it more often
    2) run it to the detriment of the rest of the offense

    Howard / Melo / Harden / McHale

    Great on *paper..........*

    Could probably even enough games to put them in upper 50s, challenge for first seed in the West. I think they would get to the Western Finals at best.

    McHale can barely get these guys to buy in now, throw in Melo. The guy who after a complete NBA season didn't play himself to shape, and lost another 15 pounds before the Olympics. The guy bitching about playing the 4 under Mike D, then goes around and has his best season running the four under his new company man coach.

    I think the Rockets need a leader, an elite leader. There's only so many of those. But look who is left in the playoffs, and think about who really has a chance to win.

    OKC
    LAC
    SAS
    MIA

    IND

  • biggajiggafigga says 2 months ago

    Every team runs ISOs, derp.... but it would seem the Rockets are one of the teams that

    1) run it more often

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago And Crawford is a 13 year veteran.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago I put Jamaal Crawford as the reigning sixth man since he won the award. Let's compare his stats to Lins for this year.

    PPG
    Lin = 12.5
    Crawford = 18.6

    APG
    Lin = 4.1
    Crawford = 3.2

    RPG
    Lin = 2.6
    Crawford = 2.3

    SPG
    Lin = 1.0
    Crawford = 0.9

    BPG
    Lin = 0.4
    Crawford = 0.2

    TOPG
    Lin = 2.5
    Crawford = 2.0

    FG%
    Lin = .446
    Crawford = .416

    3P%
    Lin = .358
    Crawford = .361

    PER
    Lin = 14.3
    Crawford = 17.3

    TS%
    Lin = .572
    Crawford = .556

    EFG%
    Lin = .508
    Crawford = .496

    Win shares / 48
    Lin = 0.103
    Crawford = 0.122

    Those numbers are pretty darn close. Crawford sacrifices efficiency for points and Lin is more efficient.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Rockets911

    you may be on to something with this petition thing. see we can reach common ground.....we agree on that. :)

    @TTDN

    I have no rose colored Lin glasses. perhaps if you have an extra pair I could view the same Lin you think you have been looking at. of the players you listed all are better and that's saying something for any list that includes JR Smith.

    @JG

    one up for the peacekeeper :)

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Lmfao I think I hit a nerve, lol it's ok you can call him a SCRUB and direct all negative attention his way. Any REAL Rockets fan and maybe not the "rockets best fan" have a total different opinion of him. You know what maybe your right, Jeremy Lin is a SCRUB! trade him for peanuts!! Get him off this team! I say me and you start a petition "rockets best fan"! Let's do it!!!

    And that's coming from a Rockets fan but also a Lin fan. He needs to get off this egotistical, underachieving team. He deserves to be in a better position, and he isn't worth what we are paying him if he's going to be used the way we used him this past year. As far as me calling out the other members on this team like specifically James Harden is quite simply this. BECAUSE HE DESERVES TO GET CALLED OUT FOR AS MUCH AS HE'S GETTING PAID! Want to talk about a SCRUB?! A guy that can't hack it in the playoffs! Well what the hell did we pay you $80 million for?! Take away the BS calls getting fouled going to the rim, and all you really have is a "average" scorer. He doesn't have a consistent jumpshot, doesn't like playing in a team concept, loves ISO Harden. Don't even start with me talking about Defense with this guy. I'm sorry I'm not the HOMER Rockets fan that's going to just excuse that because he's a so called "Star" I'm not Jason Friesman that actually called his offense "other Worldly"! Yeah his offense was in another world in the playoffs wasn't it?!

    Hell I'll even call out Parsons and I love the guy! Parsons you need to stop worrying about points and a payday!

    My name is not Clyde or Bill who sucks up to these players with their HOMER-ISM play calling that just roots for their home team to the point I'd sometimes watch with no volume on. I'll call it as I see it like I said.

    As far as trades go, still sticking with Melo for Asik/Lin/Parson. Melo's a much better scorer then Harden, and I trust Melo will put up 30+ on ANYBODY in the playoffs unlike the bearded SCRUB

    First, be careful guys...once we start questioning who is a "real" fan it usually goes downhill fast. It's safe to say we're all ridiculous Rockets fanatics which is why we are all here...on the internet, on a message board, talking about a basketball team, that isn't even playing right now....

    (On a side note, it seriously undermines one's stance of being a "better" fan when following that claim by calling the Rockets an "egotistical, underachieving team". Just my opinion...)

    If Harden's so terrible then why not trade him straight up to New York For Melo? Then we can keep Lin/Asik/Parsons, or use them in another trade--for Rondo, maybe? Well, you'd have to at least trade Lin because he can't play with Melo either--what with him taking shots away from Jeremy. :P

    Oh, and all those "pro-Lin" stats--please don't give me credit for those. Those are things that have all been thrown in my face supporting Lin. I discredit them largely since they are small sample sizes and came largely against terrible defensive teams. I was just implying some GMs will buy it...because that's what GMs do.

    I still like Lin, and can live with keeping him even after this contract--albeit, at a bit of a discount...unless he can fix the consistency. And please, before anyone tells me how his yo-yo-ing minutes and uncertain role made that difficult--stop. How is it possible that when he suddenly starts out of the blue he plays well? Or when he plays heavy minutes with lots of shots he plays well (mostly)....since it is inherent in the argument that this change and uncertainty affects him adversely. The two cancel each other out logically so one, or both, are false.

    Lin did make improvements from last season (beyond percentages, he fixed holes in his game) and I have no doubt he has a list of all the things he needs to work on this Summer. Number one must be what to do after driving into the lane and getting sealed off from the rim by the defense. Number two: find a way to focus on the task at hand and forget everything else--just play ball. Number three: write open letter to fans asking them to recognize that he is neither an all-star nor a scrub. He would like everyone to simply root for his success within the context of the team. Now hold hands and sing Bob Marley's, "Redemption Song" :D

  • Rockets911 says 2 months ago

    @Rockets911
    your lack of a creditable argument to protect Lin is disturbing :lol: :lol:........you have a right to your opinion, however trying to figure out my line of thinking seems to be beyond your level of expertise. Lin was a scrub last year....so what if he was a little better scrub this year.....still a scrub. sorry for crapping on your golden boy, but I call it the way I see it. as for Harden....if you wish to discuss him we can. however it's pitiful you need to put down another player in order for Lin to be shown in a better light. for your information I don't like Harden's turnovers or iso ball, but I don't need to toss Lin under the bus to point it out. if you wish to discuss Lin with me........stick to Lin. you want to compare him to something........try comparing him to the average NBA PG..........let me start for you......Lin's PER is 14.3 the average NBA player is 15.0...........SCRUB


    Lmfao I think I hit a nerve, lol it's ok you can call him a SCRUB and direct all negative attention his way. Any REAL Rockets fan and maybe not the "rockets best fan" have a total different opinion of him. You know what maybe your right, Jeremy Lin is a SCRUB! trade him for peanuts!! Get him off this team! I say me and you start a petition "rockets best fan"! Let's do it!!!

    And that's coming from a Rockets fan but also a Lin fan. He needs to get off this egotistical, underachieving team. He deserves to be in a better position, and he isn't worth what we are paying him if he's going to be used the way we used him this past year. As far as me calling out the other members on this team like specifically James Harden is quite simply this. BECAUSE HE DESERVES TO GET CALLED OUT FOR AS MUCH AS HE'S GETTING PAID! Want to talk about a SCRUB?! A guy that can't hack it in the playoffs! Well what the hell did we pay you $80 million for?! Take away the BS calls getting fouled going to the rim, and all you really have is a "average" scorer. He doesn't have a consistent jumpshot, doesn't like playing in a team concept, loves ISO Harden. Don't even start with me talking about Defense with this guy. I'm sorry I'm not the HOMER Rockets fan that's going to just excuse that because he's a so called "Star" I'm not Jason Friesman that actually called his offense "other Worldly"! Yeah his offense was in another world in the playoffs wasn't it?!

    Hell I'll even call out Parsons and I love the guy! Parsons you need to stop worrying about points and a payday!

    My name is not Clyde or Bill who sucks up to these players with their HOMER-ISM play calling that just roots for their home team to the point I'd sometimes watch with no volume on. I'll call it as I see it like I said.

    As far as trades go, still sticking with Melo for Asik/Lin/Parson. Melo's a much better scorer then Harden, and I trust Melo will put up 30+ on ANYBODY in the playoffs unlike the bearded SCRUB
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Lol. You seem to be incapable of rational thought when it comes to Lin. You keep throwing out scrub. But nothing to back it up. Who won 6th man of the year this year? Jamaal Crawford. Look at Lins numbers and compare them to Crawfords. They're all in Lins favor except ppg. So we traded efficiency for scoring. I'm fine with that. I don't see how you can ask for much more than what Lin gave as a sixth man. Now if you think you can find a sixth man for less, than you might have a point. But to call him a scrub is ridiculous. How much are sixth men paid?

    Jack = 6.3
    Crawford = 5.2
    Manu = 7.0
    Lin = 8.3
    JR = 5.6

    Those are the 4 off the top of my head.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Rockets911

    your lack of a creditable argument to protect Lin is disturbing :lol: :lol:........you have a right to your opinion, however trying to figure out my line of thinking seems to be beyond your level of expertise. Lin was a scrub last year....so what if he was a little better scrub this year.....still a scrub. sorry for crapping on your golden boy, but I call it the way I see it. as for Harden....if you wish to discuss him we can. however it's pitiful you need to put down another player in order for Lin to be shown in a better light. for your information I don't like Harden's turnovers or iso ball, but I don't need to toss Lin under the bus to point it out. if you wish to discuss Lin with me........stick to Lin. you want to compare him to something........try comparing him to the average NBA PG..........let me start for you......Lin's PER is 14.3 the average NBA player is 15.0...........SCRUB

  • redfaithful says 2 months ago

    @FSS :D

    Fully agree - no one can duplicate the Spurs, but taking the relevant parts from their philosophy is doable and should be high on owners' list of job requirements from GMs across the league.

  • Rockets911 says 2 months ago

    @JG
    looking at it objectively I am personally more critical of Lin than most. in my view Lin has hit his ceiling. I know many don't agree with that assessment, but IMO I feel I have watched him long enough to make such a call. many feel the problem is his fit here. I don't. I believe he plays marginal because he's a marginal player. streaky, inconsistent, makes bad decisions with the ball, struggles with confidence, defensively challenged, turnover machine, any and all of these phrases could describe him. at a time when he should be in his prime he makes the mistakes of a rookie. I hear the arguments that we must wait for him to grow up, but we must also face the fact that this may never happen. Lin is 25, he's been around long enough where some of the critical points I listed above should be disappearing but that's not happening and IMO the reason that's not happening is IT DOESN'T GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS. this is who Lin is. we either accept it and work around it or ship him to the first willing taker. if one was to be honest about the situation you would have to admit that in 2013-14 Lin looked just like 2012-13 version. little to no change from his play. if he was unable to improve this year. what positive factor can you point to that says next year will be different? I'm not talking about hoping he can get better with no clear cut path to doing so, but something concrete we can hang our hats on.we all know his short comings, but how long is an acceptable timeframe for allowing him an opportunity to overcome this 2 years? 3 years? 10? fact is we must accept the factthat all players don't improve. some simply don't have drive or physical abilities or even basketball IQ to do so. I believe Lin has the drive, but is lacking in the other two areas. that's my reason for the conclusion he has reached his ceiling. he would have value if it wasn't for his contract. I know you haveheard of being upside down in a car deal when trying to trade in a car, well we are upside down on Lin making the little value he has irrelevant


    Your lack of the whole Lin situation and opinion is disturbing.
    I see a guy that got better offensively and defensively this year. His fg%, 3pt.% both went up. His defense got better unlike the so called star on the team who got worse. The guy with the beard. You know who I'm talking about. Lins D was actually pretty solid in the post season. You mention "turnover machine ". I mention the guy with the beard again. Streaky/Inconsistent you say? I see a lot of good consistency when you give him consistent minutes and shots and a lot of bad when he doesn't. I'll revert back to what JG said when Harden was out and when ever Lin shoots 12+ shots. Unlike a lot of players, when he actually shoots more, his TS%, EFG%, FG% is even higher.

    He's reached his ceiling! Actually no he's just getting started. Your perception of him is due to your frustration for what you "think" he should do compared to the position he is in to meet those expectations. He needs out of Houston where he could actually play his game. If we get Melo we can be a top 2 seed, and Asik/Parsons/Lin are traded to NY, I guarantee Lin avgs atleast 18/8 shooting over 45% which is damn good.
  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago

    @redfaithful

    Okay, you caught me on my soapbox. Maybe you're not a young Rockets fan but if you're talking Sampson then you're about as old as me which means your memory could be losing its powers, just joking!

    No but kind of seriously, it's just frustrating to see comparisons almost everyday to the Spurs when its just not realistic. The Spurs are probably a organization that won't soon be duplicated, too many stars aligned and blah blah blah to make it happen the way it happened.

  • RocketMansinceStevieFrance says 2 months ago

    I want Rondo... Just because I am biased towards him (he is one of my favorites) and I want him running our offense. Lol in my mind he would complement not only the offense by his passing abilities but his defense is very good.

    #WHY NOT RONDO?

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @autoprt

    if it was left to me JVG would be our next coach. he fits all the things we need from the position right now

  • autoprt says 2 months ago

    yes, you make good points. i'm pretty familiar with the rox, not sure why i hadn't paid as much attention this year to this site won't go into a bash fest of other rox fan sites regarding toxicity but so far from being here there is a nice vibe in the conversation. curious to know who you think would be a good fit?

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @autoprt

    WELCOME TO THE FORUM :)I agree Mark Jackson would know more about playing PG than McFail, however even with all of McFail's shortcomings the problem is deeper than just poor guidance from the coach. we simply don't have enough talent at the PG position. you can't start with a lemon when your trying to build a Ferrari. to hire Mark Jackson here would be a mistake. while I believe him to be a decent coach, his fit here would be like trying to put a square block in a round hole.........it simply won't work. we don't need a motivational speaker. we need a real coach who understands fundamental basketball and is able to teach it to his team while holding the team accountable for their play. Jackson like McFail would find this to be beyond his field of expertise

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Journeymany

    WELCOME TO THE FORUM :)I agree........that was my point. Lin has no value, at least not enough to warrant taking on his contract without other compensation being included. I disagree that packaging Parsons is absolutely necessary. with the right trading partner a first rounder should be able to get the job done

  • Journeymany says 2 months ago

    @FSS

    at this point I would trade Lin for nothing. they can have him if willing to take on that contract. the sooner he leaves town the better I will start to feel about next season. same with Asik. to say I am disappointed with their collective production this year is an understatement. ship them together and get us a better player who won't whine or struggle with his confidence. that should be top priority for the front office this summer and from the earlier statements released by Morey I believe that's their plan.

    I'm afraid that trading Lin for nothing is pretty much delusional, because there is basically no way Lin is going anywhere unless something of value goes with him. Right now, the only high value piece there is to trade is Parsons. The question is, as asked elsewhere,is that an acceptable price to pay?

  • autoprt says 2 months ago

    since he played in the nba as one he sure as heck would know more about the position than mchale would.

  • Cooper says 2 months ago

    What does mark jackson know about coaching pgs?

  • autoprt says 2 months ago

    lin gets a pretty bad knock from folks but he's still early in his career and unfortunately mchale isn't the best coach to have if you're learning the pg position. as tony parker said pop would be on him until he really learned the position. lin or bev doesn't have that luxury. mark jackson would be an ideal coach for our pg's who still have a lot to learn if we aren't going to bring in a pg.

  • redfaithful says 2 months ago

    It amazes me that young Rockets fans or Rockets fans with poor memories think the Spurs have been a well oiled machine all along.

    @FSS - you made me feel young again! I'm a Rockets fan from afar since the day the team drafted Ralph Sampson B)

    I know the SA case is special (David Robinson effect and all), but there are other cases where great players won championship only after they started playing within a system, IMHO this is what happened to MJ and to some extent also to Hakim.

    Redfaithful: I fully agree with that, but what do you prefer we do? McHale is back - there is no changing that.

    Rahat: My hope is a philosophy adjustment from the top. The first meeting Morey has with the coaches preparing for next season should start in the spirit of: "We need a better fundamental approach on defense, we need a better fundamental approach on offense, and we need each player to fully embrace these approaches regardless of personal stats. Now tell me how we're doing all of this". If McHale or anyone else in the organization can't make this happen, we're wasting another year. I agree with JG about Howard's maturation process reaching a good place, we can only hope Harden learned enough in the Portland series to start next year as a defensive ace through the entire game.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    none what so ever

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Nobody has any worries about Melo at the 4.
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG / FSS

    true San Antonio has evolved, however even from the beginning they were solid. you do remember D-Robinson right? my argument here is what guarantee does time offer that this team will evolve?..........NONE. throwing more time at the problem doesn't relate to improvement unless some force is driving that evolution. Pop did that for the Spurs......what force do we have that can replace that factor since McFail doesn't seem up to the task? I hear all the time we are a young team, we will learn as if time is a guarantee of maturation. time can only be helpful if the right teacher is driving evolution.........without that it's wasted time

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    looking at it objectively I am personally more critical of Lin than most. in my view Lin has hit his ceiling. I know many don't agree with that assessment, but IMO I feel I have watched him long enough to make such a call. many feel the problem is his fit here. I don't. I believe he plays marginal because he's a marginal player. streaky, inconsistent, makes bad decisions with the ball, struggles with confidence, defensively challenged, turnover machine, any and all of these phrases could describe him. at a time when he should be in his prime he makes the mistakes of a rookie. I hear the arguments that we must wait for him to grow up, but we must also face the fact that this may never happen. Lin is 25, he's been around long enough where some of the critical points I listed above should be disappearing but that's not happening and IMO the reason that's not happening is IT DOESN'T GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS. this is who Lin is. we either accept it and work around it or ship him to the first willing taker. if one was to be honest about the situation you would have to admit that in 2013-14 Lin looked just like 2012-13 version. little to no change from his play. if he was unable to improve this year. what positive factor can you point to that says next year will be different? I'm not talking about hoping he can get better with no clear cut path to doing so, but something concrete we can hang our hats on.we all know his short comings, but how long is an acceptable timeframe for allowing him an opportunity to overcome this 2 years? 3 years? 10? fact is we must accept the factthat all players don't improve. some simply don't have drive or physical abilities or even basketball IQ to do so. I believe Lin has the drive, but is lacking in the other two areas. that's my reason for the conclusion he has reached his ceiling. he would have value if it wasn't for his contract. I know you haveheard of being upside down in a car deal when trying to trade in a car, well we are upside down on Lin making the little value he has irrelevant

  • Cooper says 2 months ago Gortat plays down low with nene hovering around the top of the key and baselines, Dwight can't do that, he doesn't have the shot or passing skills of nene. Harden wouldn't have any room to drive.

    I don't see why afflalo harden and parsons couldn't play together it's not like Beverley is a way better passer than any of those guys and they already hide harden on defense so that wouldn't be an issue.
  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    @Cooper,

    I don't see how Gortat doesn't make any sense. If Nene and Gortat can play together, then DH and Gortat can play together. Gortat isn't as good defensively as Asik, but he can finish at the rim and space the floor better and is way more mobile. Asik, I love his effort but his foot speed is just too slow against OKC, and the Clips. We have to remind ourselves that those are the teams of the future. ( I still think the Blazers are overrated) This has to be, the Spurs last run.

    If we get our hands on Afflalo, Parson would have to come off the bench. There is no way we can play Parsons, Harden, and Afflalo in the same lineup. I'm totally in love with Afflalo with this team.

    The idea that we need a third superstar is crazy, I think we need tough minded role players (besides Beverly) and have Harden grow up. The guy is just 24 years old. Next year, will be a very important for Harden, it will be career defining and we have to hope that he trends toward superstar than Jamal Crawford.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    It amazes me that young Rockets fans or Rockets fans with poor memories think the Spurs have been a well oiled machine all along.

    Yeah, they've been at it so long I think it is easy to presume it has always been this way.

    I forgot to mention Bellinelli in the list of guys who come in and "magically" become great players. Another Euro guy who fits their system perfectly. I'd lay money that we could trade D-Mo to them and he would instantly look like a steal. His game suits them to a "T".

    I bet a day doesn't go by where RC Buford doesn't think about calling up Memphis and seeing if Marc Gasol is available. :lol: Could you imagine?

    I think it is easy to take static views on things and forget that most everything is a process of evolution. In 3-4 years, Harden, Lin, Jones, D-Mo, Parsons, and the like will all be different players than they are today. I'm excited for Harden to add a spin move--I feel like he's got to add something since defenders are getting better at predicting his euro step--and that is a likely candidate. I'm also excited about Dwight's jump shot :D

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    @JG

    I agree NYor Orlando could be Lin's next stop. even without the star option the Orlando optiongives us a better fit for our team and a better overall player. I disagree Chicago or Sac will be interested. Lin has NO value. we are going to have to sweeten any deal involving him. we are lucky he is in the last year of his deal which makes swallowing his deal a little less painful for his suitors. the likelihood the Rockets keep him are slim IMO. his fit is bad and he struggles with confidence and consistency. the Rockets will be looking to stabilize Lin's roll next year with a different player.

    Oh come on, RBF--you've got to admit that your valuation of Lin is skewed too low. If guys like Brandon Jennings, Jose Calderon, Raymond Felton, and the like can get jobs then Lin can too. There are owners and GM's who will be willing to gamble on the idea that he actually was "held back" here and that if they give him the keys to the car he'll be a 20 & 10 guy--at worst 18 & 8. They'll see that stellar winning % when Harden was out. They'll see the numbers that indicate he gets better when he takes more shots. Largely, they will be correct. Now, we know he is too mistake prone (at least for now) and is also too streaky (again, for now) to consistently lead a team....but I think there are teams willing to take a chance--especially when it is just one year.

    I could see him getting to New York, and with a healthy (big ifs) Chandler and Stoudemire be an ideal PG to pick n roll opponents to death. Hardaway Jr. is a good developing SG and they can use Shump as a 3 & D guy to plug in at SF around that core. In the East, they could easily wind up in the 4th seed.....if healthy.

    I know you're down on Lin and nothing I say will change that, but I disagree with your valuation of him and I think other teams will as well.

  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago It amazes me that young Rockets fans or Rockets fans with poor memories think the Spurs have been a well oiled machine all along.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    One thing you ignore regarding SA's big 3 is the size of their ego. I would say the impact of Duncan, Parker and Ginobili's personal goals combined on the Spurs' basketball is much smaller than the impact of Harden and Howard's personal goals on the Rockets, separately. All these Harden isos and the low number of Howard PnRs harm the Rockets, not to mention Harden's focus on offense which hurts his defense. Pop manages to get his big 3 to play within the system, while McHale builds the system around Harden and Howard's preferences. Until that changes, we won't get near to the championship as SA did last year and have a good chance to doing again this year, no matter how loaded the west is.

    That's very true; however, this was not always the case in San Antonio. Duncan used to operate from the block extensively and was very similar to Hakeem. If the defense played him straight up he would shoot and if they doubled he would pass out to open shooters. Ginobili made his reputation the same as Harden--an elite scorer who primarily operates by getting to the rim, drawing fouls, and knocking down threes. Parker used to be limited to driving to the rim relying on his explosiveness to score. Over the years, their games evolved as has this famed "Spurs System". It didn't just happen.

    As Duncan aged, he was smart enough to defer more and more to his teammates. Parker developed a jumper. Ginobili became more of a playmaker for others.

    Duncan is a once in a lifetime talent who is extremely gifted both physically and mentally--would I prefer to have a guy like that? Of course....and so would the other 30 teams in the league. Parker and Ginobili grew up playing the international game which focuses on different elements and strategies. All of this factors into what is going on there. There is a reason guys like Diaw, Mills, and Splitter are desirable to them and a reason they consistently go after those types. Remember, they drafted Scola as well. It didn't start that way--it evolved. They started with an idea and then drafted around that. Houston is in the early stages of this.

    We don't have the right pieces around our core. Morey is in the process of drafting these pieces. He consistently goes after dead-eye 3 pt. shooting guards (Brooks, Canaan, Daniels, etc.) and tweener forwards with a full range of skills (Landry, Patterson, Parsons, Covington, Jones, D-Mo, etc.)

    To me, this points to the direction he is taking the team. I think we all have a general idea of that direction, but the nuances won't become clear until the roster is set up right, and the coaches have tweaked it to iron out the wrinkles.

    That is just for the role players. Most important are the stars. Carmelo fits both criteria. He is both a star and a tweener forward with a full range of skills. I think Morey will push hard to get him.

    Regarding Harden and Howard--the criticisms are valid. I don't view them as permanent issues. I believe they will soon hit a point (I think they have already) where this "ego" problem is overcome the same way all ego problems are overcome--through suffering. I believe Carmelo is there as well. I believe Howard when he says if you have any goal besides winning then you are not welcome here and he will take charge of ensuring that. That's huge. As a player, knowing that if Dwight thinks you aren't 100% on the same page as him he is going to call you out is a big deal. Management isn't getting rid of him--they're getting rid of you. I am excited to see the difference in our team next season.

    Oh, and on a side note--I'd just like to point out to everyone who thinks Houston is the only team that runs ISO's at the end of games and that is what's killing them--last night's LAC-OKC game concluded with both teams' stars going ISO--no plays, no pick n rolls...I did see one screen. Every team does it--for better or worse.

  • Rahat Huq says 2 months ago

    One thing you ignore regarding SA's big 3 is the size of their ego. I would say the impact of Duncan, Parker and Ginobili's personal goals combined on the Spurs' basketball is much smaller than the impact of Harden and Howard's personal goals on the Rockets, separately. All these Harden isos and the low number of Howard PnRs harm the Rockets, not to mention Harden's focus on offense which hurts his defense. Pop manages to get his big 3 to play within the system, while McHale builds the system around Harden and Howard's preferences. Until that changes, we won't get near to the championship as SA did last year and have a good chance to doing again this year, no matter how loaded the west is.

    Redfaithful: I fully agree with that, but what do you prefer we do? McHale is back - there is no changing that.

  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago

    One thing you ignore regarding SA's big 3 is the size of their ego. I would say the impact of Duncan, Parker and Ginobili's personal goals combined on the Spurs' basketball is much smaller than the impact of Harden and Howard's personal goals on the Rockets, separately. All these Harden isos and the low number of Howard PnRs harm the Rockets, not to mention Harden's focus on offense which hurts his defense. Pop manages to get his big 3 to play within the system, while McHale builds the system around Harden and Howard's preferences. Until that changes, we won't get near to the championship as SA did last year and have a good chance to doing again this year, no matter how loaded the west is.


    This is a different subject that what johnnygold addressed but it is related. The expression of player egos varies and once again San Antonio is a special situation that is pretty much unattainable now. I think where discussion about ego (often over blown and can coexist in a healthy team setting) and the Rockets stars is pertinent is when we discuss their age and maturity. To get to the point I see Howard has learned to sacrifice personal glory for the team this year which is what happens around his age. Harden on the other hand played one year carrying the team and then had to adjust in his second year to Howard's presence, that's difficult. Harden is still maturing, he's just a baby really and then fans go compare him to a Spur star player that has played almost a couple hundred playoff games, come on guys.

    Maybe bringing in Melo could have a stabilizing effect on Harden who can go back to being more of a playmaker and graduate to 1a if he stays longer than Melo someday or as Melo slows down. Just throwing scenarios around, after the last two years who knows what will happen.
  • redfaithful says 2 months ago
    All of these San Antonio comparisons lack scale and understanding in my opinion. They have a great coach and 3 stars. For some reason, Duncan, Parker, and Ginobili get zero credit for being a BIG 3....all three future hall of famers and all three having been top 5 at their position for the last decade. But let's ignore that and point to their system, their bench, and everything else besides the obvious--the great players. It only works because of them. Thibs and Pop may be able to squeeze blood from turnips when their stars are hurt, but you know what even they can't do? Win a championship....unless the "stars align". So compare us to them all you want, but trust me when I say the best way to emulate San Antonio is to acquire a third star (or somehow have Parsons, Jones, or Lin transform into one). Talent makes coaching look so much better. Does anyone think that Pop could take Miami to a 7 game finals last season with Brandon Jennings, Amir Johnson, and Joe Johnson instead of Parker, Duncan, and Ginobili? Yes, the system is nice, but it caters to the talent and it works because of the talent.

    One thing you ignore regarding SA's big 3 is the size of their ego. I would say the impact of Duncan, Parker and Ginobili's personal goals combined on the Spurs' basketball is much smaller than the impact of Harden and Howard's personal goals on the Rockets, separately. All these Harden isos and the low number of Howard PnRs harm the Rockets, not to mention Harden's focus on offense which hurts his defense. Pop manages to get his big 3 to play within the system, while McHale builds the system around Harden and Howard's preferences. Until that changes, we won't get near to the championship as SA did last year and have a good chance to doing again this year, no matter how loaded the west is.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Why aren't people addressing Melos injury issues. He's played more at the PF spot the last two years and banging with those guys down low has caused him issues with his labrum?(shoulder area). Having him at the three would lower the chances of that happening. I don't think Melo could live at the 4 for a full season.
  • Rahat Huq says 2 months ago

    Melo? You kidding me? Melo's like a Harden. All offense, defense is optional. The Rockets will never be a true contender until they solve their defensive problems.

    I agree on that last point. That's why I addressed it extensively in the article.

    Understand this, getting Melo "IS" a pipe-dream. If Defense and coaching are HOU main issue, whoever thinks adding Melo to the team is a great idea is really dreaming.

    Just like getting Dwight last summer was a pipe-dream?

    Is getting 'Melo a guarantee? Absolutely not. Is it even likely. No. I'd even venture to say that its doubtful. But pipe-dream? No. If you can't see how this is absolutely within the realm of plausibility, you are willfully ignoring the factors on the ground.

  • Cooper says 2 months ago

    Signing Gortat would make zero sense.

    I would probably try and start Harden Aflallo and Parsons on the wing if they could get him. Afflalo plus picks and one of their young guys is the magics best chance to get a real star not sure they would be willing to give that chance up for lin but if the rockets were sending a pick or perhaps TJones since they don't really have a pf, it seems like decent value and fills a glaring need for them.

    The bulls would love to dump boozer on anyone but thats just not a good deal in that case it would be better to roll with asik and lin.

    Never know what the kings are going to do so there could be a potential deal, I don't think they can afford Thomas long term if Gay decides to stick around.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @FSS

    at this point I would trade Lin for nothing. they can have him if willing to take on that contract. the sooner he leaves town the better I will start to feel about next season. same with Asik. to say I am disappointed with their collective production this year is an understatement. ship them together and get us a better player who won't whine or struggle with his confidence. that should be top priority for the front office this summer and from the earlier statements released by Morey I believe that's their plan.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    I agree NYor Orlando could be Lin's next stop. even without the star option the Orlando optiongives us a better fit for our team and a better overall player. I disagree Chicago or Sac will be interested. Lin has NO value. we are going to have to sweeten any deal involving him. we are lucky he is in the last year of his deal which makes swallowing his deal a little less painful for his suitors. the likelihood the Rockets keep him are slim IMO. his fit is bad and he struggles with confidence and consistency. the Rockets will be looking to stabilize Lin's roll next year with a different player.

  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    @thejohnnygold,

    Sac-town would be very interesting for Lin but I don't the parts to benefit us. Maybe Landry?

    ORL - I would love Affalo. I think thats the piece! Parsons would have to be ok with coming off the bench. Affalo is better.

    CHI - Their Owner is way too cheap to pay Lin and Asik.

    But if we can get Affalo, I would love that.

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago Afflalo for Lin????

    You all know I'm higher on Lin than most on this board but that trade doesn't work unless there's a 1st in there.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    To be honest, the only thing I see is Morey going after someone like Gortat (free agent), a sign and trade deal. He'll make the calls for Melo and Love, but I don't see anything happening.

    You have to hope for growth from Harden to Parsons.

    Our only trade piece is Asik and TJones and DMo.

    Trading Lin will be impossible. Nobody wants that guy unless we give up TJones or Parsons. I'm not a Lin hater, he is a solid player and I really liked on how he responded after Game 4 but 15 MIL ( 8 MIL against the Cap), that's a tough pill to swallow.

    I'm not sure about Gortat. I like him and I know Morey had shown interest in the past, but at this point we would wind up with another disgruntled back-up center making too much money. I don't think that's very likely.

    I don't think Love is an option unless Morey is willing to empty the cupboard and 1-2 other teams get involved. Melo, on the other hand, is very much in play. Phil Jackson is charming, I'm sure, but there is just no way to paint a bright future for New York. Their best way out of this is to deal Melo and reload that way.

    Which leads to my next thought. Lin is a tough trade piece, but not impossible. I think 4 teams could legitimately be interested in him right now (that could change depending on player movement). First, I'd say every team knows he is available which means if they think he has value (data supports that Lin is a strong player at PG when given the reins of the offense--someone will gamble) they can shop their own PG trying to upgrade another position and then go after him.

    Back to the 4 teams: New York, Orlando, Sacramento, and Chicago. The Knicks are obvious, plus this could be a big part of a Melo deal. Orlando is about to let Jameer Nelson walk. They just got out from under $22M of Gilbert Arenas amnesty money when this season ended so Lin's $15M won't scare them. Oladipo and Lin would make for a fun and exciting young back court to build around and Vucevic is a good Center to build around. Afflalo has two more years on his contract and I don't think Orlando got what they wanted out of him. Afflalo is making about $7.5M so the money works and he gives us a solid back up SG who can play some SF and has a reputation for playing good defense. The only question is if he is willing to be the 6th man.

    Sacramento is in play. They've got DeMarcus Cousins locked up until 2018 and he is getting ridiculously good. Rudy Gay is on board for next season at least. They have McCallum signed through 2016, but he isn't ready. Isaiah Thomas is a free agent and there is no guarantee he wants to stay or that they want him. Also, Ben McLemore is a project they are going to stick with. New ownership would like nothing better than to get a floor general who can right the ship and get them into the post-season. It also won't hurt advertising revenues and being a West Coast team helps for marketing as well. Would Morey ship out Lin for Reggie Evans (a proven rebounder/bruiser/defender) and Jason Terry (a veteran scorer with finals experience who can keep the offense humming when Harden sits) who are both expiring contracts (keeps us set up for 2015)? Maybe...plus, I wouldn't mind seeing what Lin, McLemore, Gay, Thompson/Outlaw, and Cousins could do. There's a lot to like there.

    Chicago???? Yes, Chicago. Derrick Rose is a giant question mark. Bringing in Lin gives them either a solid 6th man, or insurance in case Rose's knee falls off. Boozer wants out and just happens to make $16.8M next season. I think Chicago would trade for Lin+Asik straight up for Boozer. (It would be tough to root for Boozer, but there is no denying the man knows how to score in the post, from mid, and plays sound defense. I think he would be a great compliment to Dwight in the front court) Chicago gets Lin, plus I think they would toy with a twin towers of their own--depending on the team, Noah and Asik can give them a ridiculous defensive presence. Depending on who they ask for, we might even get them to add Mike Dunleavy for a prospect or two. It's a little far-fetched, but I think it's plausible enough to mention. Lin could also play alongside Rose giving them a starting 5 of Rose, Lin, Butler, and 2 of Noah, Gibson, and Asik. That's pretty good.

    Until other moves happen I don't think any other teams would give us value or even want Lin as they have PG's they like already. Ultimately, I think the Rockets like Lin and still see potential there. They won't trade him just to get rid of him. The odds are he only gets moved in a 3rd star scenario.

  • Matt Maloney's Ghost says 2 months ago

    To be honest, the only thing I see is Morey going after someone like Gortat (free agent), a sign and trade deal. He'll make the calls for Melo and Love, but I don't see anything happening.

    You have to hope for growth from Harden to Parsons.

    Our only trade piece is Asik and TJones and DMo.

    Trading Lin will be impossible. Nobody wants that guy unless we give up TJones or Parsons. I'm not a Lin hater, he is a solid player and I really liked on how he responded after Game 4 but 15 MIL ( 8 MIL against the Cap), that's a tough pill to swallow.

  • Steven says 2 months ago Trade Asik and Lin to anybody plus a first, sign LeBron. My offseason is done.
  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Since it's on most everyone's mind and popping up in lots of different threads I thought we'd just open up an official thread for all kinds of personnel talk. Whether it's who to sign, trade for, keep, or get rid of--let the armchair GM's do their thing :)

    I'll post some useful references so that we can all refer to them easily.

    Here is our salary status:

    4Dupg2h.jpg

    Note that the "Total Figures" at the bottom are all-inclusive and are not indicative of our "cap total". For instance, next season we are set to pay $71, 980, 426, but we need to deduct Scola's salary, reduce Lin and Asik to $8.4M (roughly), and Parsons' contract may change as well. LINK to source.

    Here is another that breaks it down with the Salary Cap in mind...sorry the top got cut off.

    6718qGk.jpg

    SOURCE

    Per ESPN.com, this is roughly what the league salary caps will be next season:

    "Sources told ESPN.com that all 30 teams were informed this week via league memorandum that an increase in the cap from this season's $58.6 million to $63.2 million in 2014-15 -- thanks to increased revenues -- is now expected. A corresponding rise in the luxury-tax threshold from $71.7 million to $77 million is also projected, sources said."

    So that leaves lots and lots of room to play with (although it goes fast :( )

    Here are some links to Free Agent Listings:

    HoopsHype

    ESPN

    And what would we do without the TRADE MACHINE?

    (all potential trades will be ripped apart so post with caution :P)

    FYI: Rondo is making roughly $12M next year and Melo is set to make roughly $24M for a max deal.

    This is what I read about his potential next contract:

    "The Knicks can offer him up to $129 million over five seasons, while other suitors max out at four years and $96 million. "

    Finally, here is a WIKI that explains trade rules, salary cap, and various exceptions, etc. Most questions can be answered here. Larry Coon's page is considered the end-all-be-all source for CBA knowledge. Check it out HERE.

  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago

    I don't see us getting Melo without losing Asik, which, of course is the hardest part to accept. Harris could fill the bill for sure. With Melo though, I still like Beverley running the show at PG, just for as well as he is able to protect the ball, he rarely turns it over and is rarely the victim of a steal. I think, given the initiative, Beverley could do some impressive scoring himself, he's got a nice floater and decent from range.. McHale just hasn't given him the directive to do so..



    Right, that sounded like I was talking in circles. I guess I just meant another center along Dwight. That was kind of an afterthought that I could have left off my post since I know Asik isn't staying and hopefully Lin's contract gets moved as well.

    Wonder if Brooks will come back again?
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @TTDN

    agreed. one fact that we must accept is Asik is toast if we bring a third star here. if we bring Melo inhis contract is necessary to make the numbers work. if we bring in Rondo he will probably be the center piece of the deal because we'd have to put a whole lot of draft pick sweetener to even make them consider Lin. with a third max or near max salary on thebooksAsik's contract would probably push us near luxury tax territory or maybe even over it when we consider the Parsons situation. I know Les is willing to pay the tax, but the longer we delay it the more sustainable the team becomes. it's just not realisticAsik will be here next year especially after histirade this year. sure it appeared he bought in after the allstar break, but there's also no doubt that he allowed his personal situation to become a distraction for the team. with both Morey and Les releasing statements expressing flexibility about the cap and realizing that this can only happen with both Lin and Asik gone, I'd say they have a clear cut plan and neither of these players are part of it

  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago No way we get Melo without losing Asik. The salaries don't match.
  • Alituro says 2 months ago

    I think Devin Harris could be a good pick up at the 1 and make Beverley the defensive specialist off the bench. (Assuming we have Beverley after acquiring Anthony)

    I think this team still needs a big off the bench guy that qualifies as a bruiser.


    I wonder with Harden, Anthony and a decent shooting point guard if you can run the twin towers more?

    I don't see us getting Melo without losing Asik, which, of course is the hardest part to accept. Harris could fill the bill for sure. With Melo though, I still like Beverley running the show at PG, just for as well as he is able to protect the ball, he rarely turns it over and is rarely the victim of a steal. I think, given the initiative, Beverley could do some impressive scoring himself, he's got a nice floater and decent from range.. McHale just hasn't given him the directive to do so..

  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago I think Devin Harris could be a good pick up at the 1 and make Beverley the defensive specialist off the bench. (Assuming we have Beverley after acquiring Anthony)

    I think this team still needs a big off the bench guy that qualifies as a bruiser.


    I wonder with Harden, Anthony and a decent shooting point guard if you can run the twin towers more?
  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @JG

    that's hitting the nail on the head. totally agree. we are in an arms race out west and minor tweaks are not going to get the job done.

  • thejohnnygold says 2 months ago

    Understand this, getting Melo "IS" a pipe-dream. If Defense and coaching are HOU main issue, whoever thinks adding Melo to the team is a great idea is really dreaming.

    Defense and coaching are the things people are blaming. The "problem" (if there is one) is experience, maturity, and the simple fact that we exist in a conference loaded with talent, experience, and maturity. The attitude that the championship is ours for the taking if we just ___________ (insert complaint about defense, coaching, pg, pf, acquire player x, etc.) is myopic and dismissive of the fact that 30 other teams are all trying to do the same thing with really good players and coaches too.

    There are no guarantees and acquiring Melo, Rondo, Love, Aldridge, LeBron or anyone at all doesn't change that.

    Melo is the most likely candidate for acquisition. Concerns about him making us better should be put to bed. The guy is far above Terrence Jones' highest ceiling. He is better than Aldridge, Bosh, and Love. Offensively, he solves a lot of our problems. Defensively, I think he will be fine.

    He gives us a huge mismatch and is able to do so playing the 3 or the 4. He has a very good post game, mid-range game, and three point game. His ball-stopping reputation is as much a function of his teams as it is his "selfishness".

    I don't think there are any problems with "are there enough shots for everyone"..."there's only one ball"....This league is an arms race and we are currently short-handed.

    All of these San Antonio comparisons lack scale and understanding in my opinion. They have a great coach and 3 stars. For some reason, Duncan, Parker, and Ginobili get zero credit for being a BIG 3....all three future hall of famers and all three having been top 5 at their position for the last decade. But let's ignore that and point to their system, their bench, and everything else besides the obvious--the great players. It only works because of them. Thibs and Pop may be able to squeeze blood from turnips when their stars are hurt, but you know what even they can't do? Win a championship....unless the "stars align". So compare us to them all you want, but trust me when I say the best way to emulate San Antonio is to acquire a third star (or somehow have Parsons, Jones, or Lin transform into one). Talent makes coaching look so much better. Does anyone think that Pop could take Miami to a 7 game finals last season with Brandon Jennings, Amir Johnson, and Joe Johnson instead of Parker, Duncan, and Ginobili? Yes, the system is nice, but it caters to the talent and it works because of the talent.

    Houston has a plan--a system--which they are trying to acquire the right talent for. This is the only reason I can find to not acquire Melo. Like RBF said above, in a free style offense like this a heady PG who can create for others consistently in a variety of ways, can read defenses and break them down is a must-have. As much as I like our PG situation (mostly) it could stand a big time upgrade....Rondo is a question mark....but I think he would work. Eric Bledsoe is not that guy. Neither is Chalmers. They are few and far between. Greivis Vaquez could be a solid pick up.

    Barring a PG acquisition like this, our best bet for an upgrade is Melo....and that is a very, very good thing. Right now, Houston is losing an arms race with the Clippers--more than any other team they are the biggest roadblock for us getting out of the West....and OKC....and Portland....

  • Alituro says 2 months ago

    Understand this, getting Melo "IS" a pipe-dream. If Defense and coaching are HOU main issue, whoever thinks adding Melo to the team is a great idea is really dreaming.

    That's funny, because if you Google: Carmelo Anthony and click on the news tab, all you get is articles about the possibility of him coming here. I guess you know better though?

    There are plenty of opinions posted here that explain why it is a good idea, and a few that explain why it isn't.

    Understand this, If we expect Charles B to substantiate any of his opinions rather than just insulting everyone else's then the posters at Red94 are really dreaming.

    Not sure if any of you worried about defense even read Rahat's article.

    Do those of you with defensive concerns about Anthony believe Jones is any better at defense? Even if you do believe Jones is better is the difference even comparable to how much better the offense would be with Anthony? Aren't those relatively simple answers?

    This^

  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago

    Not sure if any of you worried about defense even read Rahat's article.

    Do those of you with defensive concerns about Anthony believe Jones is any better at defense? Even if you do believe Jones is better is the difference even comparable to how much better the offense would be with Anthony? Aren't those relatively simple answers?

  • Charles B says 2 months ago

    Understand this, getting Melo "IS" a pipe-dream. If Defense and coaching are HOU main issue, whoever thinks adding Melo to the team is a great idea is really dreaming.

  • Alituro says 2 months ago

    Good post.. I simply don't buy into the diatribe that Melo wouldn't be able to function with Harden together on the court. Main reason is.. How do we know? What team has Melo been on that had another prolific scorer like Harden (much less two players who are tops at their position)? I think he's earned his reputation simply as a factor of always being on teams that had no potent second option on offense. Shump and Smith were the only ones he would possibly defer to to take a shot, but why reduce the chances of it falling if he is so damn deadly with the mid-range jumper? Dwight and Harden can both boast finals experience. Melo is sick and tired of losing, I think he would adjust fine here. If nothing else the jury is still out whether he could function on a well-built team I would be all for giving him that chance. I think a package with Lin, Asik and Parsons could be attractive to the Knicks. They replace Melo's scoring contributions with Parsons and Lin and get superb rim protection as a bonus. A lineup of Lin, Shump/Smith, Parsons, (insert PF(shoot, throw Jones in on the deal too)), and Asik can make the playoffs in the east, especially seeing what ATL was able to get in with. If we are able to form a Big 3, then it will be easy to fill in the voids left with vets on mins. I think the biggest holes in our team, from watching the playoffs, are experience and veteran leadership..

  • biggajiggafigga says 2 months ago

    I don't see Carmelo meshing well in Houston, especially if McHale is still the coach.

    Melo's never been known for being a chemistry guy, and there is going to be one ball to share between so many ball dominant guys.

    SIDENOTE - Watching the Spurs do such minor adjustments like using the pick and roll as well as making LMA go his to his uncomfortable hand..... and we've got another year at least of McHale bumbling through the playoffs.

  • rockets best fan says 2 months ago

    @Rahat

    totally totally agree. Melo is a no-brainer. I hear the concerns of those who worry about ego problems over who gets the ball, but I think the Rockets have plenty of shots to go around once you limit some of the players taking shots now. Melo is a good passer so him and D-12 would probably flourish together as they would be hard for any team to match on the front court. I think if used properly the combination of Harden, D-12 and Melo can be as deadly as the Miami threesome. I do still believe the Rockets will need an upgrade at PG though. we need to get the ball out of Harden's hands. Harden is a finisher not an initiator or facilitator. Yes he makes great passes on occasion, but to many turnovers from bad decisions. we need someone who is better at handling that roll. I'm not saying I don't love what Beverly gives us, but getting the ball in someone's hand who can help the team get better looks at the basket is absolutely necessary to improve this team. normally a good coach could design plays that would reduce this burden, however since we don't have that advantage PG upgrade it is.

  • chantu says 2 months ago

    Melo? You kidding me? Melo's like a Harden. All offense, defense is optional. The Rockets will never be a true contender until they solve their defensive problems.

  • payplay2 says 2 months ago

    The Rockets have the players to win if they play as a team. Harden and Melo are not team players. The ball movement tend to stop when either one receives the ball. Both are also defensive liabilities. It would take a better coach than McHale to create an atmosphere where Harden, Melo and Howard would become team players.

  • Cooper says 2 months ago With Dwight not being a 20ppg guy on a regular basis anymore I think adding a 3rd star is the way to go, melo or bosh would be great. Rondo would be ok even with his limitations he would bring an attitude/toughness that we currently lack. We do need a lot of cards to fall our way to get either.
  • timetodienow1234567 says 2 months ago I do wonder about Harden/Melo. Can Harden take a backseat to Melo? He would have to. Melo wouldn't come here to play Robin.
  • feelingsupersonic says 2 months ago

    Maybe Melo would take a two year contract? Ha!

    Look I am of the opinion if you can get a healthy superstar you give it the go ahead every time but I think you have me more convinced now. The defensive argument is a poor one against the Anthony acquisition and usually just carryover from the vocal Harden naggers. You keep Harden and Howard and everyone else is on the table I imagine, looking forward to seeing Morey make this happen.