80 replies to this topic

[Sir Thursday]

I really like what the Pelicans have done here. Gordon has been a poor investment for them so far, but he should be healthy this year and a three guard rotation of Holiday/Gordon/Evans is actually pretty strong. While conventional wisdom would dictate that making moves like this is a recipe for mediocrity, the Pelicans have the luxury of already having a 'superstar in waiting' on the roster in Anthony Davis so they don't really have to worry about that. This roster is now chock full of young players, many of whom were previously in bad situations and thirsty for a chance to experience winning at an NBA level. Giving them a year to work together and figure a few things out about what it takes to be successful seems like a pretty good idea to me.

 

Furthermore, the circumstances that brought the team together included a trade that saw the Pelicans dealing their 2014 pick. That means there is zero incentive for them to do anything other than play hard and try to get to the playoffs. Hopefully that means that the whole organisation is working in unison to put the best product they can on the floor, and I think that's probably healthy for the team as a whole. Tanking may be a reasonable strategy, but it teaches a lot of bad habits along the way and that's something the Pelicans would do well to avoid cultivating.

 

Going to enjoy watching these guys next year!

 

@Rolling Wave: I think the Pelicans can wait and see on Eric Gordon. A lot of his poor play and slow injury convalescence in the last year or so has been ascribed to discontent with the team. You would hope that the bold moves the FO has made this offseason would give him some enthusiasm to play his best. It's still possible that he could turn into the very good player his play for the Clippers promised.

 

ST

[RollingWave]

@ ST, in Gordon's 5 year career, he has missed at least 20 games since his rookie year,  it is very hard to believe in his health now, and what's worse is that he NEEDS to be really good for his deal to just break even, he's making 13/14/14 for the next 3 years. that's right, Eric Gordon is paid more than James Harden.

[cjuice28]

well, given RBF's opinion of Eric Bledsoe I think we can write the Suns into playoff contention now

 

Also, I think a lot of guys here miss a point.

 

Teams must spend 90% of their cap space every season under the new CBA, so even if your tanking, you MUST still a payroll within the range of 50m or so.

 

Well actually you don't have to. You get charged a fee for the difference between the 90% floor and your spending level, if your below the the 90% floor. The fee gets allocated to the rest of the team. Actually its not a bad deal, especially if your team is only a few Million below the floor since you maintain flexibility for future years.

 

http://www.cbafaq.co...larycap.htm#Q15

[cjuice28]

@Thursday

 

The Pelicans will definitely be better next year. If somehow they fall apart the 2014 pick was Top 3 protected, so I guess you have that. But what's the ceiling for that team? They're a bubble team next year, but I don't think they're title contenders in the long-term. Now they're capped out, and you're not getting any significant draft help.

 

What would it take for them to become title contenders? To me that would require 2 of their 4 guys (Gordon, Evans, Holiday, Davis) to become Top 10-15 players. As great as those guys are, I don't see that potential in any of them besides Davis. I struggle to think of comparable guards who have made that leap at the same point in their career.

 

Building a title contender is difficult and painful, but next year's draft offers one of the best chances to get elite talent in recent years. Now if you're the owner I get that you may prefer the surefire 1st round exit team, over years of being the cellar dweller every year, but I think that's become a bit of false choice. It seems the one thing bad teams usually have is cap space. Detroit, Charlotte, and New Orleans all decided they wanted to chase 8 seeds next year.

[RollingWave]

 I can't fault the Pelicans to try though, with that group they should at least be a contender for the bottom half of the seeds next year , though the West is always brutal , look at it this way.

 

Barring INCREDIBLY bad injury luck

 

Thunder

Spurs

Rockets

Clippers

Grizzly

 

I think we can all agree these 5 are locked for the playoffs and most likely the the top 5 team in whatever order depending on luck and development.

 

Nuggets

Warriors

 

I think these 2 are fairly safe bets for the playoffs.

 

That leaves just ONE spot open, but the following team can plausbily contend.

 

Pelicans

Wolfs

Lakers? (assuming Kobe returns fairly quick and effective, a big if but not impossible given his track record. still need bad things to happen to other contenders though.)

Mavricks (they're better than you think, certainly will be in the mix.)

Blazers

 

that's 5 teams already, only 1 spot.

 

I could even make a arguement that with a semblance of defense system and maybe Cousins taking a step forwards the Kings aren't that far from this group either.

 

all in all, I see no chance for Phx and Utah next year, but almost every one else is in play. that's how scary the West is.

[Johnny Rocket]

I think that the Mavericks have had a terrible free agency period thus far.  So far they've spent the bulk of their cap room on two older guards who will help them be average at best next year, with little hope to improve down the road.  I get the sense that Cuban  is hopelessly adrift.  Am I missing something?

 

The Hawks are another interesting case.  They did so well in clearing tons of cap space, but have spent it in a way that makes it more or less impossible to be real contenders.

[Dan G]

I think that the Mavericks have had a terrible free agency period thus far.  So far they've spent the bulk of their cap room on two older guards who will help them be average at best next year, with little hope to improve down the road.  I get the sense that Cuban  is hopelessly adrift.  Am I missing something?

 

The Hawks are another interesting case.  They did so well in clearing tons of cap space, but have spent it in a way that makes it more or less impossible to be real contenders.

The Mavericks have had a terrible free agency period two years in a row. All you hear from Dallas fans now is complaining about how Cuban didn't keep his championship team together. I understand exactly why Cuban did it and I actually agree with his strategy. He didn't want to give Barea, Butler and Chandler multi-year contracts when he knew Williams would be a FA last off season and he didn't bring back Terry and Kidd this last season knowing better FAs were available this offseason. So he decided to conserve his cap space, go all in, and hope Nowitzki's stardom could lure one or multiple big fish to Big D. Only problem with that strategy is the big FAs can only choose one place each and there were better fits out there since Nowitzki and his surrounding cast (if you can call it a surrounding cast) is older.

 

I actually think Cuban and the Mavs were damned if they did and damned if they didn't. He would not have won another championship had he held on to Barea, Butler, Chandler and Terry, and it doesn't look like he will be any closer in the foreseeable future. They will bounce back though eventually just like the Lakers will unfortunately.

 

Same basic story with the Hawks give or take a few players. Both the Mavs and Hawks were trying to pull a Miami and strip their team bare and win the FA Superstar Sweepstakes only this time they both came up empty. Atleast Nowitzki was able to win one before he rides off into the sunset.

[RollingWave]

And yet the Mavs were in the playoff hunt until the last week of the season.

 

their roster has limited upside in the playoffs, but experience often counts a lot , I figure as long as they get a half decent center they'll be able to still be in the mix, are they the favorites to make that 8th seed? no, but they'll be around,  a fully healthy season from Dirk would go a long way, Jose Calderon is a top 5 offensive PG (but is brought down to more like a top 10 PG due to his D and his age and health is scary going forward.)  but if Calderon and Dirk is healthy, that offense will be quite good.

 

Marion / Brand / Carter were all star players, of course all of them are way past their prime, but when used in more limited role they're really good, Carter's reinvention especially have been pretty amazing. but lost in a blah season for the Mavs.

 

they'll be a solid team, their floor at worst is a 35ish win team unless Dirk gets hurt again, if your floor is there then it only takes a few things to go right to be in range for the 8th seed.

 

But yeah, the longer term outlook for them is bad, that doesn't mean they are going to be REALLY bad in the short term though.

 

 

They need a solid center, I would like Asik a lot if I were Cuban, but I don't think Morey really wants to deal with him and they don't have a lot to give back anyway.

 

In terms of just next year, if the Mavs really care about staying in the playoffs, the simple way is to simply make a max offer to Pekovic, if the Wolfs don't match, then they fixed their biggest issue AND eliminated one of their main competitor all in one swoop, if they do match, well at least you reduced their ability to improve that team going forward.

Edited by RollingWave, 07 July 2013 - 08:41 AM.

[Cooper]

In hindsight the mavs should have kept chandler, the other guys are replaceable but chandler makes them a legit threat.

[Rockets fan newton]

I agree that Dallas had to make the move..i might have paid tyson money..he wasnt that far away from Dwight and dwill would have signed if chandler was there in my opinon..i would take the nuggets out of the playoffs next year..to many good teams in the West and Karl is onenofthe best coaches in the nba..they will only win 40 games next year..depending on who Dallas gets at center and if he is healthy then they will get in..I agree with the one spot for the rest..I like Minny of they play Def, Lakers, Denver,Portland,and pelicans to fight for the last spot..with Portland or Minny getting the spot

[RollingWave]

Tough, Chandler's making 14+ a year though, that's a bit hard to justify for a guy who's essentially Greg Smith (one dimensional but really great PnR offense) + Omer Asik (really solid defense) but not healthy...  Though yes, if your going to overpay a guy, make sure he's a center.

[Dan G]

Ouch Dallas' woes continue as they can't even get a hurt Bynum to ink a deal with them.

[RollingWave]

Maybe they should trade Shane Larking (son of HOF player Barry Larkin) to the Orioles for Jon Rauch (6'11 reliever) that's one loophole Cuban should totally look into, trading across sports! they can absorb Marian's contract too since no cap in baseball lol!

Edited by RollingWave, 11 July 2013 - 09:24 AM.

[RollingWave]

Jeff Teague signs a 4/32 with the Bucks, Hawks have 3 days to match. (i'd guess they will.)

 

So, would you like Teague for 4/32 more than Lin for 2 /16?

[Steven]

Jeff Teague signs a 4/32 with the Bucks, Hawks have 3 days to match. (i'd guess they will.)

So, would you like Teague for 4/32 more than Lin for 2 /16?

Teague.

[thejohnnygold]

Teague vs. Lin?  It's a toss up.  Teague is better in iso, but Lin is far superior in pick n roll (which says a lot given Teague had Horford and Smith to play with vs. Lin playing with Asik and G. Smith).  Once again, Lin is rated as a better defender as well (all per mysynergysports.com).  Both are primed to get better so we'll see...

[Mario Peña]

I think Kirelinko to the Nets is a pretty big acquisition for Prokorov and Brooklyn(at the very least suspicious). They have players in their prime on the wing and in the post, they have some serious experience on the roster and they possess depth that insures them versus injury and depth that allows them to rest and maintain key players. The question is can they build enough chemistry to propel them deep into the playoffs. I think this year I like them more than the Bulls.

[timetodienow1234567]

I think they're better off starting AK, and bringing Pierce off the bench as the 6th man. I found it funny that King started talking about going small with KG at the 5 and Pierce at the 4. It shows how little they think of Lopez. I watched quite a few games of Brooklyn's and positive things happened when the offense ran through Lopez rather than Johnson's ISOs. I agree he isn't a rim protector, but he's not a poor defender anymore. I think chemistry will be very important to this team.

[Johnny Rocket]

Brooklyn will be interesting--a talented and accomplished roster, but also a lot of age and potential defensive liabilities.  If I were a Nets fan, I'd worry that it will take them a year to figure things out--and then it might be too late for guys like Williams, Johnson, and Pierce.

[Steven]

Brooklyn is gonna pay Les millions for a loss in the second round.