306 replies to this topic

[rockets best fan]

@JG / FSS

true San Antonio has evolved, however even from the beginning they were solid. you do remember D-Robinson right? my argument here is what guarantee does time offer that this team will evolve?..........NONE. throwing more time at the problem doesn't relate to improvement unless some force is driving that evolution. Pop did that for the Spurs......what force do we have that can replace that factor since McFail doesn't seem up to the task? I hear all the time we are a young team, we will learn as if time is a guarantee of maturation. time can only be helpful if the right teacher is driving evolution.........without that it's wasted time

[timetodienow1234567]

Nobody has any worries about Melo at the 4.

[rockets best fan]

@TTDN

none what so ever

[redfaithful]

It amazes me that young Rockets fans or Rockets fans with poor memories think the Spurs have been a well oiled machine all along.

 

@FSS - you made me feel young again! I'm a Rockets fan from afar since the day the team drafted Ralph Sampson

 

I know the SA case is special (David Robinson effect and all), but there are other cases where great players won championship only after they started playing within a system, IMHO this is what happened to MJ and to some extent also to Hakim.

 

Redfaithful: I fully agree with that, but what do you prefer we do?  McHale is back - there is no changing that.  

 

Rahat: My hope is a philosophy adjustment from the top. The first meeting Morey has with the coaches preparing for next season should start in the spirit of: "We need a better fundamental approach on defense, we need a better fundamental approach on offense, and we need each player to fully embrace these approaches regardless of personal stats. Now tell me how we're doing all of this". If McHale or anyone else in the organization can't make this happen, we're wasting another year. I agree with JG about Howard's maturation process reaching a good place, we can only hope Harden learned enough in the Portland series to start next year as a defensive ace through the entire game.

Edited by redfaithful, 10 May 2014 - 06:58 PM.

[autoprt]

lin gets a pretty bad knock from folks but he's still early in his career and unfortunately mchale isn't the best coach to have if you're learning the pg position.  as tony parker said pop would be on him until he really learned the position. lin or bev doesn't have that luxury. mark jackson would be an ideal coach for our pg's who still have a lot to learn if we aren't going to bring in a pg. 

[Cooper]

What does mark jackson know about coaching pgs?

[autoprt]

since he played in the nba as one he sure as heck would know more about the position than mchale would.  

[Journeymany]

@FSS

at this point I would trade Lin for nothing. they can have him if willing to take on that contract. the sooner he leaves town the better I will start to feel about next season. same with Asik. to say I am disappointed with their collective production this year is an understatement. ship them together and get us a better player who won't whine or struggle with his confidence. that should be top priority for the front office this summer and from the earlier statements released by Morey I believe that's their plan.

 

I'm afraid that trading Lin for nothing is pretty much delusional, because there is basically no way Lin is going anywhere unless something of value goes with him. Right now, the only high value piece there is to trade is Parsons. The question is, as asked elsewhere,is that an acceptable price to pay?

[rockets best fan]

@Journeymany

WELCOME TO THE FORUM  I agree........that was my point. Lin has no value, at least not enough to warrant taking on his contract without other compensation being included. I disagree that packaging Parsons is absolutely necessary. with the right trading partner a first rounder should be able to get the job done

[rockets best fan]

@autoprt

WELCOME TO THE FORUM  I agree Mark Jackson would know more about playing PG than McFail, however even with all of McFail's shortcomings the problem is deeper than just poor guidance from the coach. we simply don't have enough talent at the PG position. you can't start with a lemon when your trying to build a Ferrari. to hire Mark Jackson here would be a mistake. while I believe him to be a decent coach, his fit here would be like trying to put a square block in a round hole.........it simply won't work. we don't need a motivational speaker. we need a real coach who understands fundamental basketball and is able to teach it to his team while holding the team accountable for their play. Jackson like McFail would find this to be beyond his field of expertise

[autoprt]

yes, you make good points. i'm pretty familiar with the rox, not sure why i hadn't paid as much attention this year to this site won't go into a bash fest of other rox fan sites regarding toxicity but so far from being here there is a nice vibe in the conversation.  curious to know who you think would be a good fit?

[rockets best fan]

@autoprt

if it was left to me JVG would be our next coach. he fits all the things we need from the position right now

[TheHolyBeardedOne]

I want Rondo... Just because I am biased towards him (he is one of my favorites) and I want him running our offense. Lol in my mind he would complement not only the offense by his passing abilities but his defense is very good. 

 

#WHY NOT RONDO? 

[Mario Peña]

@redfaithful

 

Okay, you caught me on my soapbox. Maybe you're not a young Rockets fan but if you're talking Sampson then you're about as old as me which means your memory could be losing its powers, just joking!

No but kind of seriously, it's just frustrating to see comparisons almost everyday to the Spurs when its just not realistic. The Spurs are probably a  organization that won't soon be duplicated, too many stars aligned and blah blah blah to make it happen the way it happened.

[Rockets911]

@JG
looking at it objectively I am personally more critical of Lin than most. in my view Lin has hit his ceiling. I know many don't agree with that assessment, but IMO I feel I have watched him long enough to make such a call. many feel the problem is his fit here. I don't. I believe he plays marginal because he's a marginal player. streaky, inconsistent, makes bad decisions with the ball, struggles with confidence, defensively challenged, turnover machine, any and all of these phrases could describe him. at a time when he should be in his prime he makes the mistakes of a rookie. I hear the arguments that we must wait for him to grow up, but we must also face the fact that this may never happen. Lin is 25, he's been around long enough where some of the critical points I listed above should be disappearing but that's not happening and IMO the reason that's not happening is IT DOESN'T GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS. this is who Lin is. we either accept it and work around it or ship him to the first willing taker. if one was to be honest about the situation you would have to admit that in 2013-14 Lin looked just like 2012-13 version. little to no change from his play. if he was unable to improve this year. what positive factor can you point to that says next year will be different? I'm not talking about hoping he can get better with no clear cut path to doing so, but something concrete we can hang our hats on. we all know his short comings, but how long is an acceptable timeframe for allowing him an opportunity to overcome this 2 years? 3 years? 10? fact is we must accept the fact that all players don't improve. some simply don't have drive or physical abilities or even basketball IQ to do so. I believe Lin has the drive, but is lacking in the other two areas. that's my reason for the conclusion he has reached his ceiling. he would have value if it wasn't for his contract. I know you have heard of being upside down in a car deal when trying to trade in a car, well we are upside down on Lin making the little value he has irrelevant

Your lack of the whole Lin situation and opinion is disturbing.
I see a guy that got better offensively and defensively this year. His fg%, 3pt.% both went up. His defense got better unlike the so called star on the team who got worse. The guy with the beard. You know who I'm talking about. Lins D was actually pretty solid in the post season. You mention "turnover machine ". I mention the guy with the beard again. Streaky/Inconsistent you say? I see a lot of good consistency when you give him consistent minutes and shots and a lot of bad when he doesn't. I'll revert back to what JG said when Harden was out and when ever Lin shoots 12+ shots. Unlike a lot of players, when he actually shoots more, his TS%, EFG%, FG% is even higher.

He's reached his ceiling! Actually no he's just getting started. Your perception of him is due to your frustration for what you "think" he should do compared to the position he is in to meet those expectations. He needs out of Houston where he could actually play his game. If we get Melo we can be a top 2 seed, and Asik/Parsons/Lin are traded to NY, I guarantee Lin avgs atleast 18/8 shooting over 45% which is damn good.

[redfaithful]

@FSS

 

Fully agree - no one can duplicate the Spurs, but taking the relevant parts from their philosophy is doable and should be high on owners' list of job requirements from GMs across the league.

[rockets best fan]

@Rockets911

your lack of a creditable argument to protect Lin is disturbing ........you have a right to your opinion, however trying to figure out my line of thinking seems to be beyond your level of expertise. Lin was a scrub last year....so what if he was a little better scrub this year.....still a scrub. sorry for crapping on your golden boy, but I call it the way I see it. as for Harden....if you wish to discuss him we can. however it's pitiful you need to put down another player in order for Lin to be shown in a better light. for your information I don't like Harden's turnovers or iso ball, but I don't need to toss Lin under the bus to point it out. if you wish to discuss Lin with me........stick to Lin. you want to compare him to something........try comparing him to the average NBA PG..........let me start for you......Lin's PER is 14.3 the average NBA player is 15.0...........SCRUB

[timetodienow1234567]

Lol. You seem to be incapable of rational thought when it comes to Lin. You keep throwing out scrub. But nothing to back it up. Who won 6th man of the year this year? Jamaal Crawford. Look at Lins numbers and compare them to Crawfords. They're all in Lins favor except ppg. So we traded efficiency for scoring. I'm fine with that. I don't see how you can ask for much more than what Lin gave as a sixth man. Now if you think you can find a sixth man for less, than you might have a point. But to call him a scrub is ridiculous. How much are sixth men paid?

Jack = 6.3
Crawford = 5.2
Manu = 7.0
Lin = 8.3
JR = 5.6

Those are the 4 off the top of my head.

[Rockets911]

@Rockets911
your lack of a creditable argument to protect Lin is disturbing ........you have a right to your opinion, however trying to figure out my line of thinking seems to be beyond your level of expertise. Lin was a scrub last year....so what if he was a little better scrub this year.....still a scrub. sorry for crapping on your golden boy, but I call it the way I see it. as for Harden....if you wish to discuss him we can. however it's pitiful you need to put down another player in order for Lin to be shown in a better light. for your information I don't like Harden's turnovers or iso ball, but I don't need to toss Lin under the bus to point it out. if you wish to discuss Lin with me........stick to Lin. you want to compare him to something........try comparing him to the average NBA PG..........let me start for you......Lin's PER is 14.3 the average NBA player is 15.0...........SCRUB

Lmfao I think I hit a nerve, lol it's ok you can call him a SCRUB and direct all negative attention his way. Any REAL Rockets fan and maybe not the "rockets best fan" have a total different opinion of him. You know what maybe your right, Jeremy Lin is a SCRUB! trade him for peanuts!! Get him off this team! I say me and you start a petition "rockets best fan"! Let's do it!!!

And that's coming from a Rockets fan but also a Lin fan. He needs to get off this egotistical, underachieving team. He deserves to be in a better position, and he isn't worth what we are paying him if he's going to be used the way we used him this past year. As far as me calling out the other members on this team like specifically James Harden is quite simply this. BECAUSE HE DESERVES TO GET CALLED OUT FOR AS MUCH AS HE'S GETTING PAID! Want to talk about a SCRUB?! A guy that can't hack it in the playoffs! Well what the hell did we pay you $80 million for?! Take away the BS calls getting fouled going to the rim, and all you really have is a "average" scorer. He doesn't have a consistent jumpshot, doesn't like playing in a team concept, loves ISO Harden. Don't even start with me talking about Defense with this guy. I'm sorry I'm not the HOMER Rockets fan that's going to just excuse that because he's a so called "Star" I'm not Jason Friesman that actually called his offense "other Worldly"! Yeah his offense was in another world in the playoffs wasn't it?!

Hell I'll even call out Parsons and I love the guy! Parsons you need to stop worrying about points and a payday!

My name is not Clyde or Bill who sucks up to these players with their HOMER-ISM play calling that just roots for their home team to the point I'd sometimes watch with no volume on. I'll call it as I see it like I said.

As far as trades go, still sticking with Melo for Asik/Lin/Parson. Melo's a much better scorer then Harden, and I trust Melo will put up 30+ on ANYBODY in the playoffs unlike the bearded SCRUB

[thejohnnygold]

Lmfao I think I hit a nerve, lol it's ok you can call him a SCRUB and direct all negative attention his way. Any REAL Rockets fan and maybe not the "rockets best fan" have a total different opinion of him. You know what maybe your right, Jeremy Lin is a SCRUB! trade him for peanuts!! Get him off this team! I say me and you start a petition "rockets best fan"! Let's do it!!!

And that's coming from a Rockets fan but also a Lin fan. He needs to get off this egotistical, underachieving team. He deserves to be in a better position, and he isn't worth what we are paying him if he's going to be used the way we used him this past year. As far as me calling out the other members on this team like specifically James Harden is quite simply this. BECAUSE HE DESERVES TO GET CALLED OUT FOR AS MUCH AS HE'S GETTING PAID! Want to talk about a SCRUB?! A guy that can't hack it in the playoffs! Well what the hell did we pay you $80 million for?! Take away the BS calls getting fouled going to the rim, and all you really have is a "average" scorer. He doesn't have a consistent jumpshot, doesn't like playing in a team concept, loves ISO Harden. Don't even start with me talking about Defense with this guy. I'm sorry I'm not the HOMER Rockets fan that's going to just excuse that because he's a so called "Star" I'm not Jason Friesman that actually called his offense "other Worldly"! Yeah his offense was in another world in the playoffs wasn't it?!

Hell I'll even call out Parsons and I love the guy! Parsons you need to stop worrying about points and a payday!

My name is not Clyde or Bill who sucks up to these players with their HOMER-ISM play calling that just roots for their home team to the point I'd sometimes watch with no volume on. I'll call it as I see it like I said.

As far as trades go, still sticking with Melo for Asik/Lin/Parson. Melo's a much better scorer then Harden, and I trust Melo will put up 30+ on ANYBODY in the playoffs unlike the bearded SCRUB

 

First, be careful guys...once we start questioning who is a  "real" fan it usually goes downhill fast.  It's safe to say we're all ridiculous Rockets fanatics which is why we are all here...on the internet, on a message board, talking about a basketball team, that isn't even playing right now....

 

(On a side note, it seriously undermines one's stance of being a "better" fan when following that claim by calling the Rockets an "egotistical, underachieving team".  Just my opinion...)

 

If Harden's so terrible then why not trade him straight up to New York For Melo?  Then we can keep Lin/Asik/Parsons, or use them in another trade--for Rondo, maybe?  Well, you'd have to at least trade Lin because he can't play with Melo either--what with him taking shots away from Jeremy.  

 

Oh, and all those "pro-Lin" stats--please don't give me credit for those.  Those are things that have all been thrown in my face supporting Lin.  I discredit them largely since they are small sample sizes and came largely against terrible defensive teams.  I was just implying some GMs will buy it...because that's what GMs do.

 

I still like Lin, and can live with keeping him even after this contract--albeit, at a bit of a discount...unless he can fix the consistency.  And please, before anyone tells me how his yo-yo-ing minutes and uncertain role made that difficult--stop.  How is it possible that when he suddenly starts out of the blue he plays well?  Or when he plays heavy minutes with lots of shots he plays well (mostly)....since it is inherent in the argument that this change and uncertainty affects him adversely.  The two cancel each other out logically so one, or both, are false.

 

Lin did make improvements from last season (beyond percentages, he fixed holes in his game) and I have no doubt he has a list of all the things he needs to work on this Summer.  Number one must be what to do after driving into the lane and getting sealed off from the rim by the defense.  Number two: find a way to focus on the task at hand and forget everything else--just play ball.  Number three: write open letter to fans asking them to recognize that he is neither an all-star nor a scrub.  He would like everyone to simply root for his success within the context of the team.  Now hold hands and sing Bob Marley's, "Redemption Song"