64 replies to this topic

[Red94]

New post: Should the Rockets trade Jeremy Lin?

[Alituro]

Maybe not, but we definitely need to replace our starting PG, and FAST! Lin still has some developing to do, and it's quite early in his contract to completely give up on him yet, but I would consider reasonable offers. I don't know what kind of motivation a team would have for giving up a decent PG for Lin though. We have plenty of incentive to develop him some more. But if we're going to try and continue to win games, it will need to be done with him coming off the bench. In the meantime, I'd start Douglas with the idea he'll continue to get a little better as well, and can showcase him in case a trade offer comes.

[bob schmidt]

I have nothing against Lin, but always feel that he only produces when he is in what I call a "jail break" mode. I see little of what I call the art and beauty of a controlled attack in the manner of a Stockton or Nash. As a Harvard man, I know he has the intellect to change/improve his game, but do not know if he has the right coaching and mindset to accomplish real change. If not, he will eventually join others on the scrap heap of guys that did not work out...

[Rahat Huq]

i think they should trade him. but i don't know if ownership would ever allow that.

[xsamc1]

I agree that benching Lin is not the answer. If the goal is to keep him, then the coaching staff has to give him more opportunities to learn from his mistakes or to gain confidence in his accomplishments. If the goal is to trade him, then the coaching staff has to put the ball in Lin's hands and give him opportunities to increase his trade value. And although I'm a Lin fan, from just watching the games this season, it's obvious that he's hurting the team more than helping right now. He has zero confidence in his game and the coaching staff has zero confidence in his game. But I argue that Douglas is just as bad.

[Rahat Huq]

Do you all think the Lakers would go for a Lin/Gasol swap (with parts added in to even it out)? It would make the Rockets infinitely better as Lin basically is givng them nothing right now. I guess the rationale for LA would be to have a stop gap now until Nash comes back and then a long time solution after Nash moves on.

[AndrewMcCarthys]

@Rahat, what would we do with Pau? Sure he's an upgrade over Patterson right now and might put us into the 8th seed but afterwards what is his value to our team moving forward? He'd only further block development of our other potential future fours, right? Not trying to be sarcastic or anything, just curious as to why we keep scrambling back to Pau when it seems that ship sailed months ago.

As for Lin, I don't see management shipping him out anytime soon. For one thing, the capital gains off his "brand" alone is worth keeping him for at least the year. Second, I might be in the minority, but I still feel this is too small of sample size to gauge what his potential with this team might be. That sample size is getting larger and harder to argue with every weak performance by Lin, but it's been a pretty tumultuous year for almost everyone on this team.

Lastly, what happened to us? Weren't we totally prepared for a pretty rough year during the offseason? Landing Harden has drastically changed our fortunes but even then I didn't think we'd be much for serious competition. We're a young dumb team that makes a lot of stupid mistakes. That excuse still works right now but won't in a year or so.

[Rahat Huq]

Andrew:

My reason for wanting Pau is as a salary stop-gap until 2014. It's become apparent that this team will be doing its building through FA/trade and not through the draft. Thus, the goal should be to become as competitive as possible without taking on long term salary. Bringing in Pau, in my opinion, makes us a 50 win team (if extrapolated out to the full year) and makes us a threat. We keep the rest of our young nucleus intact. Then, when Pau is up in 2014, we look much more attractive on the market and bring someone else in.

[Sir Thursday]

I don't think trading Lin is the right move at this point. All of the best teams in the league have one of two things in common: experience (see New York, Boston) or stability (San Antonio, Miami, Memphis, OKC). Given the age of our roster, we are not going to get the first of those, so we need to aim for some of the second. At some point the high turnover of personnel has to stop in order for the players to get accustomed to their roles and figure out how to play with each other.

As McHale has repeatedly said and has been obvious when watching the games, there is little sophistication to how the Rockets play right now. That is a product of youth and unfamiliarity, and for all that the team has great potential they do not have the skills required at the moment to be able to win on talent alone. The only way sets are going to be implemented and the team is going to evolve is if they are given some time to work together.

In Lin's case, as many have pointed there appears (I am unwilling to outright say 'there is' because it's not like I can peer inside his skull) to be a mental block that's preventing him from playing his best basketball. But we can all see that basketball is spectacular when he is able to produce it. There is no reason to suspect that he won't be able to get past this in time - let us not forgot that many young players struggle with similar issues in their first season or so. Giving up on him after 20-30 games seems premature when you consider that many draft picks are given several years to display their potential.

Also, I don't think I agree that this season has become a 'win-at-all-costs' exercise. Obviously it would be nice to get into the playoffs, but it will be far from the end of the world if they miss out. I definitely don't think that trading Lin in exchange for a couple of extra wins this season is worth it in the big picture.

ST

[Paradise]

Bench Lin, start Machado. Make a move for Demarcus Cousins. That's what would make me happy.

[xsamc1]

What Lin needs is a coach who believes in him and gives him the green light. If he can play without worrying that he'll get benched as soon as he makes 1 mistake, he'll play much better.

[Rahat Huq]

Sir Thursday: I see your point, but if you know something isn't an optimal fit, does it make sense to ride it out and gain stability with it? Wouldn't you cut the cord earlier and build stability with something else?

For instance, the Raptors probably know Bargnani and Valanciunas can't play next to each other because they're both flowers. But they'd definitely improve with stability over the years. But if they know from the start that the peak will never be optimal, wouldn't they trade Bargnani from the start?

[xsamc1]

Paradise, on 17 December 2012 - 06:50 PM, said:

Make a move for Demarcus Cousins. That's what would make me happy.

That might make you happy but Cousins is way too volatile.

[Rahat Huq]

I don't think I'd infect this team with Cousins. I wanted it before but that was before Harden.

[Chichos]

We always hear that the easiest skill to acquire is a solid jump shot and Lin is a solid jump shot away from being a fringe all star.

I really liked the Tony Parker comparisons Lin got after the San Antonio game. We have to at least wait another off seasons to see what Lin can become. He already looks like a much more complete player where fundamentals are concerned.

When the Rockets invested in Lin they invested in his growth potential as much as his current production. So lets watch him grow. The kid can ball.

[Sir Thursday]

Paradise, on 17 December 2012 - 06:50 PM, said:

Bench Lin, start Machado. Make a move for Demarcus Cousins. That's what would make me happy. The youth movement needs to be implemented more.

I don't think it's possible to field a competitive basketball team if we make it any younger. The Rockets are already the youngest team in the league and you want to get even less experienced? The Sacramento Kings are a cautionary tale for teams that pursue youth at all costs. I think if Cousins had come into the league with a more mature locker room he wouldn't be making the same hotheaded mistakes he's making these days any more.

Rahat Huq, on 17 December 2012 - 06:52 PM, said:

Sir Thursday: I see your point, but if you know something isn't an optimal fit, does it make sense to ride it out and gain stability with it? Wouldn't you cut the cord earlier and build stability with something else?

For instance, the Raptors probably know Bargnani and Valanciunas can't play next to each other because they're both flowers. But they'd definitely improve with stability over the years. But if they know from the start that the peak will never be optimal, wouldn't they trade Bargnani from the start?

I don't necessarily agree that the Bargnani/Valanciunas analogy applies here. In that case, you have two guys that play the same position due to physical attributes (and even then, I think it's arguable that with a bit more time to grow into his frame Valanciunas will be capable of being a much better post defender/physical big man), whereas with the Rockets you just have two players who's current skill sets are quite similar, and that's something that ca nbe changed/improved upon. There are two key skills that Lin needs to develop in order to play well with Harden: the ability to make a play off the catch and a reliable outside shot. Neither of these are innate attributes that can't be taught. Furthermore, at least with the first of those nobody on the team would have realised that Lin needed until the Harden deal was done.

Part of the value of having young players is that you are able to mold their games to a certain extent to get them to maximise their talents with their environment, and I still think you can do that here without losing what Lin does well. I don't think that means remaking his game entirely - if that were the case then you'd be right. It's just one or two key things that aren't there right now but could be in a season's time.

ST

[Rahat Huq]

Sir Thursday, on 17 December 2012 - 07:21 PM, said:

I don't necessarily agree that the Bargnani/Valanciunas analogy applies here. In that case, you have two guys that play the same position due to physical attributes (and even then, I think it's arguable that with a bit more time to grow into his frame Valanciunas will be capable of being a much better post defender/physical big man), whereas with the Rockets you just have two players who's current skill sets are quite similar, and that's something that ca nbe changed/improved upon. There are two key skills that Lin needs to develop in order to play well with Harden: the ability to make a play off the catch and a reliable outside shot. Neither of these are innate attributes that can't be taught. Furthermore, at least with the first of those nobody on the team would have realised that Lin needed until the Harden deal was done.

Part of the value of having young players is that you are able to mold their games to a certain extent to get them to maximise their talents with their environment, and I still think you can do that here without losing what Lin does well. I don't think that means remaking his game entirely - if that were the case then you'd be right. It's just one or two key things that aren't there right now but could be in a season's time.

ST

Very good point.

[Paradise]

Sir Thursday, on 17 December 2012 - 07:21 PM, said:

I don't think it's possible to field a competitive basketball team if we make it any younger. The Rockets are already the youngest team in the league and you want to get even less experienced? The Sacramento Kings are a cautionary tale for teams that pursue youth at all costs. I think if Cousins had come into the league with a more mature locker room he wouldn't be making the same hotheaded mistakes he's making these days any more.

You're right. I just think that some of our more youthful players should get more playing time. Even though all we pretty much have on the floor are young players.
I understand the situation of Cousins, and I understand that we probably will not make that move because of the problems that could occur. I was simply just stating a different course of action.

[blakecouey]

I believe we should trade him, if not now then during the offseason. It may be a small sample size, but I agree with what Rahat said in that it may get better but it will never be optimal. Both players, Lin and Harden will benefit from being separated. I don't think we should bench Lin though, that would plummet his value, and our second option of TD isn't ideal either.

I'd like to see us pursue a trade for Lawson, or Devin Harris. Lawson would be ideal, but I don't think Denver is a market that would benefit much from Lin(and they'd certainly lose talent). Devin Harris is a vastly underrated player in my opinion, in a contract year, on a team that looks to be getting a fresh start next season(with Josh Smith probably leaving, and only 7 players under contract for next year). With Atlanta playing well so far this year I don't know if they'd be willing to do a blockbuster trade, including both Harris and Smith, but that would be exciting(regardless of however improbable).

[Johnny Rocket]

My two cents: be patient, keep him, and try different combinations. We've barely played a quarter of the schedule, our head coach was gone for a month, and we have the youngest team in the league. It is way, way too early to be drawing any conclusions.