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@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 10:35 PM) Has anyone noticed that Morey is more comfortable typing than speaking?
@  2016Champions : (16 August 2013 - 08:53 PM) Daryl Morey's reddit AMA today: http://www.reddit.co...eason_addition/
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:54 PM) (Although having said that, Cleveland and Washington being improved mean that there might actually be some competition towards the bottom of the Eastern Conference playoff bracket for once).
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:53 PM) They may end up with the 8th seed again this year, but they'll be a team on the up rather than a team that's reached its peak.
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:52 PM) That's a lot of shooting, anyhow. And they've filled the bench with serviceable players, too.
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:49 PM) (or maybe you put Gary Neal in for Delfino)
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:48 PM) It's not a roster completely devoid of talent, anyway. Knight/Mayo/Delfino/Ilyasova/Sanders seems like a reasonable starting lineup.
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:45 PM) A lot depends on if they can develop their young guys. Knight, Henson, Antetokounmpo...
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:41 PM) Although this signing does make them look better to me.
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:40 PM) Maybe. I don't really care all that much, but it just seems like he's being underpaid. And why would he want to stay in MIL? Have you seen the moves they've made thus far.
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:36 PM) A player with 7 years' experience qualifies for a bigger max contract, right? Maybe he's angling for that
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:33 PM) I hope he has an ETO. That would make the deal make sense in my mind. Otherwise why not play next year and get offered the max by a desperate team and have MIL match?
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:32 PM) Then why not get a 5th year?
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:31 PM) And if Sanders doesn't mind Milwaukee then he would probably want as long a contract as possible...maximise guaranteed money and all that.
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:30 PM) Milwaukee probably have a bit more leverage than most teams do in contract negotiations in that [a] it's an extension rather than a resign, so they could just let him to to RFA; and [b] they have a really deep front court rotation.
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:29 PM) True about Pek, but I don't consider them elite rim protectors like in the vein of Duncan/KG/Asik/Howard/Gasol/Noah/Hibbert(showed improvement last year). Drummond and Sanders are potential candidates for rim protectors in my opinion.
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:26 PM) Unless he has an opt out clause after two years(he might) this was a dumb deal.
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:26 PM) If he had to agree to the 11 per to get a 5th year, then I could see it.
@  timetodienow... : (16 August 2013 - 06:26 PM) I agree with you in a vacuum. But with Splitter making 9 mil per and Pek making 12 per and all of the other bigs making money, I don't think so.
@  Sir Thursday : (16 August 2013 - 06:25 PM) Pekovic got $60M/5 years...so a bit more. He's played long enough minutes to be sure it's sustainable though.

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Realistic PF targets, and why LMA isn't one of them.


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#1 RollingWave

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    Posted 15 August 2013 - 02:27 PM

    I know the talk of LMA is all the fad, but looking at it more and more, I find it to be both unlikely and not nearly as practical of a move as most people assume.

     

    It's not only a matter of the cost to get him, which might end up requiring Parsons, but it's also the issue that LMA's best ability (scoring, especially in iso) is likely to be limited by the fact that he wont' get enough touches and the team's current style seem to fit poorly with his skill set.  if he's not shooting enough , it becomes very dubious if he's worth that sort of money.

     

    If you don't believe me , just take a look at Chris Bosh and Ray Allen's FG attempt per game or per 36 after they formed the big 3.  Bosh gets a lot of flak these days but in reality what really happened is that he lost about 3-4 shot attempt going from Toronto to Miami and thus had his greatest value , scoring .. reduced.

     

    LMA is essentially a slightly more watered down version of Bosh, which may shock folks who never seen Bosh in his Raptor days, so there's a very significant chance that he becomes a water downed version of Miami Bosh if he comes to the Rockets, which would be pretty ugly.

     

    Ray Allen also saw this too, he went from 26 points on 21 shots in his last year in Seattle, to 17 points and 13 shots in the next year in Boston (granted, he also played fewer minutes, but the drop was amazing. he essentially went from amazing to merely solid . ) 

     

    So , beware of what your getting,

     

    I'm of the opinion that Asik and Howard is at least worth experimenting for half a season if not a full season and I see reasons why it could work out, but if it doesn't work out,  and the team really aims to trade a full time PF, the following guys is who I see as seriously underrated and probably a great fit with the team.

     

    All of them are at least solid defensively.  can hit mid range shot or more effectively, an does a lot of off ball things really really well. and they're cost and situation is at the point where they are at least theoretically tradable to us without us losing a Chandler Parsons in the process. and all of them are not too old to the point where you fear they see massive decline quickly.

     

    My list is

     

    1. Paul Millsap

    2. Thaddeus Young

    3. Ersan Ilyasova

    4. Amir Johnson

     

    of the group,  Millsap seems like the most obvious candidate in terms of trade lineup, because the Hawks have long expressed a desire to push Al Horford to the 4 and pair him with a great , he just signed so the trade can't happen for half a season, but like i said we most certainly want at least half a season to see what happens as well.  Millsap is a very complete player who do a lot of things, and his defense have also been raved on, he was probably the best player on those post Williams Jazz teams,  that was generally fairly competent.

     

    The next one in terms of lineup is probably Thaddeus Young, in that... he's almost certainly available... and that the phone between Houston and Philly is surely wide open,  Young has been basically the one good player on a bunch of disastrous philly teams,  last year.. Jrue Holiday made the all star team, but if you look at the season , Young was almost certainly their best player.   the dude can shoot (added bonus, he's also lefty ;)  ) and he can defend pretty well too,  he just screams of a guy that should do well in a better situation. and what's more sad is that he actually did shoot the 3 reasonably... until Doug Collins apparantly decided that was a bad idea ... oops.

     

    Ersan Ilyasova is another guy.. he's leathal from 3, just a step down from Ryan Anderson, but almost certainly more of an asset on defense.  I don't see how a trade lineup with the bucks at the moment, seeing that you wouldn't want to pair Asik with Larry Sanders, but I suppose theoretically a trade involving Lin might interest them. Though that really depend on a lot of things that hasn't happened yet.

     

    And finally there's Amir Johnson, he's been in the league for a long time but only 25, he plays a very physical style but also have a decent touch from mid range, is the best rebounder of this group, and generally been buried in Toronto, which is unfortunate , but it's not hard to see his ability, especially a great offensive board guy.

     

    Trading Johnson seem to be the hardest to lineup, seeing that the Raptors have center and PG locked up, and with their current roster configuration and now finally with a competent GM, I figure they'd more likely keep Johnson than trade him. unless the package is overwhelming.

     

    Another guy who's a step below these 4, but almost certainly easier to get, would be Jason Thompson, for him, you might not even need a Asik or Lin, trading a Jones or Dmo or pick + random pieces might do. and most certainly if you offer Asik it happen easily and we might get other things in return.  I suppose a trade of Asik +Jones for Thompson + Chuck Hayes a 2nd rounder might be kinda interesting. I would hope for the price of Asik we'd get someone a bit more proven though. like the 4 guys I'd named above.

     

     

     

     


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    #2 CC.

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    Posted 15 August 2013 - 07:35 PM

    Why didn't you include Ryan Anderson in your list though? I'd take him over Amir Johnson, personally.


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    #3 Buckko

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      Posted 15 August 2013 - 07:56 PM

      Why would we pay that much for a 5th option PF. Completely redundant. All we need them them to do is rebound, defence, and hit a 3. That's it. We don't need to pay 8-10 million for a guy to score 8-10 points when we have jones, demo, and casspi  to do that.  


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      #4 Buckko

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        Posted 15 August 2013 - 08:00 PM

        I know the talk of LMA is all the fad, but looking at it more and more, I find it to be both unlikely and not nearly as practical of a move as most people assume.

         

        It's not only a matter of the cost to get him, which might end up requiring Parsons, but it's also the issue that LMA's best ability (scoring, especially in iso) is likely to be limited by the fact that he wont' get enough touches and the team's current style seem to fit poorly with his skill set.  if he's not shooting enough , it becomes very dubious if he's worth that sort of money.

         

        If you don't believe me , just take a look at Chris Bosh and Ray Allen's FG attempt per game or per 36 after they formed the big 3.  Bosh gets a lot of flak these days but in reality what really happened is that he lost about 3-4 shot attempt going from Toronto to Miami and thus had his greatest value , scoring .. reduced.

         

        LMA is essentially a slightly more watered down version of Bosh, which may shock folks who never seen Bosh in his Raptor days, so there's a very significant chance that he becomes a water downed version of Miami Bosh if he comes to the Rockets, which would be pretty ugly.

         

        Ray Allen also saw this too, he went from 26 points on 21 shots in his last year in Seattle, to 17 points and 13 shots in the next year in Boston (granted, he also played fewer minutes, but the drop was amazing. he essentially went from amazing to merely solid . ) 

         

        So , beware of what your getting,

         

        I'm of the opinion that Asik and Howard is at least worth experimenting for half a season if not a full season and I see reasons why it could work out, but if it doesn't work out,  and the team really aims to trade a full time PF, the following guys is who I see as seriously underrated and probably a great fit with the team.

         

        All of them are at least solid defensively.  can hit mid range shot or more effectively, an does a lot of off ball things really really well. and they're cost and situation is at the point where they are at least theoretically tradable to us without us losing a Chandler Parsons in the process. and all of them are not too old to the point where you fear they see massive decline quickly.

         

        My list is

         

        1. Paul Millsap

        2. Thaddeus Young

        3. Ersan Ilyasova

        4. Amir Johnson

         

        of the group,  Millsap seems like the most obvious candidate in terms of trade lineup, because the Hawks have long expressed a desire to push Al Horford to the 4 and pair him with a great , he just signed so the trade can't happen for half a season, but like i said we most certainly want at least half a season to see what happens as well.  Millsap is a very complete player who do a lot of things, and his defense have also been raved on, he was probably the best player on those post Williams Jazz teams,  that was generally fairly competent.

         

        The next one in terms of lineup is probably Thaddeus Young, in that... he's almost certainly available... and that the phone between Houston and Philly is surely wide open,  Young has been basically the one good player on a bunch of disastrous philly teams,  last year.. Jrue Holiday made the all star team, but if you look at the season , Young was almost certainly their best player.   the dude can shoot (added bonus, he's also lefty ;)  ) and he can defend pretty well too,  he just screams of a guy that should do well in a better situation. and what's more sad is that he actually did shoot the 3 reasonably... until Doug Collins apparantly decided that was a bad idea ... oops.

         

        Ersan Ilyasova is another guy.. he's leathal from 3, just a step down from Ryan Anderson, but almost certainly more of an asset on defense.  I don't see how a trade lineup with the bucks at the moment, seeing that you wouldn't want to pair Asik with Larry Sanders, but I suppose theoretically a trade involving Lin might interest them. Though that really depend on a lot of things that hasn't happened yet.

         

        And finally there's Amir Johnson, he's been in the league for a long time but only 25, he plays a very physical style but also have a decent touch from mid range, is the best rebounder of this group, and generally been buried in Toronto, which is unfortunate , but it's not hard to see his ability, especially a great offensive board guy.

         

        Trading Johnson seem to be the hardest to lineup, seeing that the Raptors have center and PG locked up, and with their current roster configuration and now finally with a competent GM, I figure they'd more likely keep Johnson than trade him. unless the package is overwhelming.

         

        Another guy who's a step below these 4, but almost certainly easier to get, would be Jason Thompson, for him, you might not even need a Asik or Lin, trading a Jones or Dmo or pick + random pieces might do. and most certainly if you offer Asik it happen easily and we might get other things in return.  I suppose a trade of Asik +Jones for Thompson + Chuck Hayes a 2nd rounder might be kinda interesting. I would hope for the price of Asik we'd get someone a bit more proven though. like the 4 guys I'd named above.

        Honestly I think they want to keep young for a veteran in his prime when they MCW, Noel, probably Wiggins and someone like Aron Gorden or a PF in full swing.


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        #5 Cooper

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          Posted 15 August 2013 - 08:33 PM

          Why would we pay that much for a 5th option PF. Completely redundant. All we need them them to do is rebound, defence, and hit a 3. That's it. We don't need to pay 8-10 million for a guy to score 8-10 points when we have jones, demo, and casspi to do that.

          our current pf is the 5th option just because they aren't that good, getting a millsap young etc they wouldn't be the 5th option.
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          #6 Buckko

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            Posted 15 August 2013 - 08:45 PM

            our current pf is the 5th option just because they aren't that good, getting a millsap young etc they wouldn't be the 5th option.

            We don't need another huge scorer. Lin and Parsons together will be 30 points a night at least, Howard will be 20-23, Harden 23-27 (Will become more efficient and get more open looks), add in 10 points for jones.

            You would get around 70-90 points from your starters. I will even go light with 60-80 then you still have bench scorers in Garcia, Beverley, Demo, and Williams.

            Adding another major player would just force our other players to shoot and scorer less which would make it completely redundant and makes this "star PF" an severely overpaid role player. Along with the fact of destroying our 2nd unit's defense and killing our Howard insurance in trading asik.


            Edited by Buckko, 15 August 2013 - 08:46 PM.

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