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@  2016Champions : (17 June 2013 - 05:26 AM) I had a feeling Ginobili would regress to the mean.
@  Dan G : (17 June 2013 - 04:33 AM) Now I had no idea Ginobli was gonna pull a Wade and turn back the clock. I give Pop the majority of the credit for that.
@  Dan G : (17 June 2013 - 04:32 AM) I don't think it was too ballsy on San Antonio's part. With the way Splitter has been playing and since Miami has started Miller the last two games, I thought it was inevitable that Ginobli would start.
@  RollingWave : (17 June 2013 - 02:57 AM) I must say that both team had some serious ballsy lineup changes this series, Ginobilli start? and dominate?
@  2016Champions : (16 June 2013 - 09:26 PM) According to Dr. Klapper, treatment for Parker's hamstring will only last one half. Lateral movement and jumping will be a problem.
@  2016Champions : (16 June 2013 - 04:56 AM) Parker said Pop was very angry with him for the constant nagging insisting he can play, Pop really didn't want Parker to play. Just goes to show Pop knows best.
@  RollingWave : (16 June 2013 - 04:28 AM) Parker says his hamstring is almost shot , that would probably doom the Spurs if he can't play at least 80%
@  2016Champions : (15 June 2013 - 12:38 AM) Miami is 6-0 in playoffs following losses (outscoring opponents by 20.7 PPG in those games). They've won 12 straight games following losses.
@  2016Champions : (14 June 2013 - 04:50 PM) The Heat are notoriously slow starters. Once they get going it's like a snowball effect, they get more dangerous as they go along.
@  2016Champions : (14 June 2013 - 04:49 PM) My heart says SA, but my mind says MIA
@  rocketrick : (14 June 2013 - 11:06 AM) Anybody else going to San Antone for Game 5??
@  RollingWave : (14 June 2013 - 10:15 AM) The Heat is doomed / the Spurs is doom , repeat until game 7
@  2016Champions : (14 June 2013 - 06:28 AM) Now that Wade's knee doesn't seem to be bothering him anymore, Spurs are in trouble.
@  rocketrick : (14 June 2013 - 06:26 AM) Mark Twain once was quoted--Reports of my demise have been greatly exaggerated. Not sure that motivates the Heat but food for thought for whatever that is worth!
@  2016Champions : (14 June 2013 - 04:43 AM) What happened to Parker that second half? Hamstring caught up to him?
@  Ostrow : (14 June 2013 - 03:57 AM) Has Manu had any good playoff games?
@  RollingWave : (14 June 2013 - 03:50 AM) G4 was very interesting, both teams making big adjustments, but I think at the end of the day Wade's rejuvenation / dead cat bounce versus Manu 's continued suck is the difference
@  RollingWave : (13 June 2013 - 08:49 AM) @rocketrick lol good one. I honestly don't know what happens now, I was expecting Spurs to win G3 but not by THAT much
@  rocketrick : (12 June 2013 - 10:55 AM) I can't wait for Game 5 after the Heat burn the Spurs on Thursday night
@  RollingWave : (12 June 2013 - 06:52 AM) The amazing thing is this 2nd rounder and undrafted guy played like super stars while the best player ever an another sure fired HOF guy played like junk

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Defense wins championships


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#21 Steven

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    Posted 24 April 2013 - 08:37 PM

    Last nights GS/DENVER game will be more entertaining than any game in the eastern conference the entire playoffs. And I don't watch the All-Star game because there is no effort. I want to see effort, but last nights 131-115 games is how I want my basketball. You can keep your 87-71 84-82 games. Run up and down the court and go after the other guys.

    #22 2016Champions

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    Posted 24 April 2013 - 08:46 PM

    To me, this was one of the most memorable games I've ever seen (They put Pippen on Barkley at the 2 minute mark):

     


    Don't be too quick to assume you're right and the experts are wrong. 

     

    "A fool who recognizes his own ignorance is thereby in fact a wise man, but a fool who considers himself wise -- that is what one really calls a fool." ~Gautama Buddha


    #23 thenit

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      Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:14 PM

      Sounds good....and your articulation is fine.

       

      I do think Harden's defense sinks the teams' numbers on the whole.  His help defense does nothing except to get him just far enough out of position for his assignment to get open looks (and often knock them down).  On any basketball team, if one player is incapable of playing defense (or just unwilling) it forces the other players to spread the efforts out more thinly as they have to compensate for the weaknesses and voids created.

       

      Thus, the Rockets are playing the game with 2 open holes in their defense (Harden and whoever is at PF).  One is due to lack of effort and the other is due to lack of experience/know-how.  To me, this is a testament to the other three players as their play will improve (as you noted) once we get a capable PF and will improve lots once Harden gets over himself.

       

      A side note: does anyone else ever find themselves worrying that James Harden may be the second coming of Baron Davis (I keep telling myself it's just the beard making me think that)?  Davis was notoriously lazy and unmotivated throughout his career.  They actually share a similar playing style and frame as well.  When motivated, Davis was arguably one of the best players in the league....the rest of the time he left a trail of crushed hopes and fan despair in his out-of-shape, arrogant wake.  Please, don't let this be the case....

       

      GOD I hope not, but he does look similar to Davis. Great observation. I don't think so, I think Harden has the drive thats why he came to be THE MAN, a couple of seasons will teach him or we the fans has to do some public shaming.



      #24 2016Champions

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      Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:24 PM

      I liked Davis in his prime. I think Harden is already as good as Davis prime, and he will be even better next season. 

       

      This reminds me, Morey said this Thunder-Rockets series has a lot of similarities to the Mavericks-Warriors series :D


      Don't be too quick to assume you're right and the experts are wrong. 

       

      "A fool who recognizes his own ignorance is thereby in fact a wise man, but a fool who considers himself wise -- that is what one really calls a fool." ~Gautama Buddha


      #25 Ostrow

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        Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:30 PM

        I'm not sure about the comparison.  I think Davis' abilities were based on his athleticism.  Harder is a smarter player and, I think, more skilled than Davis, but is a worse athlete.  Davis was also a career 32% 3-point shooter with his best year being 35.6% (Harden is at 37% right now).



        #26 thejohnnygold

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        Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:41 PM

        Ah, but we must remember...Davis, when he tried, was AMAZING...it is a mistake to judge him from his stats alone, or even entire seasons when he decided to not bother.  If I remember right, they once did an interview amongst NBA players as to who the "best player in the league was" and there were a lot of "Baron Davis" answers.  If I just dreamt that and thought it was real then nevermind...

         

        2016, I like your optimism about Harden being better than Davis' prime...I'm not convinced of that yet.  One of Davis' best attributes was as a closer.  Tim Hardaway was the same way.  You just knew that when they took that three in the last minute or two of the game...even if they had missed 10 shots in a row...that one was going in.  I hope someday I feel that way when Harden shoots...



        #27 timetodienow1234567

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        Posted 24 April 2013 - 09:58 PM

        The only thing I disagree with in the original post is putting Lin and Harden at the same level of defense.

         

        Lin = Average defender.

        Harden = FAR below average defender(nearing atrocious)

         

        Also, Beverley is not a GREAT defender yet because of his inconsistencies. He makes too many mistakes. Once he corrects those, he'll be up there.


        Why so Serious? :D


        #28 Jason

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          Posted 25 April 2013 - 07:53 AM

          The only thing I disagree with in the original post is putting Lin and Harden at the same level of defense.

          Lin = Average defender.
          Harden = FAR below average defender(nearing atrocious)

          Also, Beverley is not a GREAT defender yet because of his inconsistencies. He makes too many mistakes. Once he corrects those, he'll be up there.


          Beverley was great defensively in this game.

          #29 RollingWave

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            Posted 25 April 2013 - 11:15 AM

            Parsons' DRTG this year is actually very bad, though I think that's more of a matchup issue than anything else, aka  we usually have him on the best opposing player and Lin on the better of the 2 guards .  it's pretty clear that the team certainly think Lin's a better defender than Harden if you look at who they guard in most games. his weakness is mostly in lateral quickness. so yeah he does get blown by sometimes. 

             

            From a stats POV, Houston actually gets burned in transition a lot more, in half court set they're pretty good, like top 3rd type good, but in Transition they get destroyed, part of that is bad coordination, part of that is Harden arguing calls / not getting back up.

             

            How to improve? best thing to do is probably like you know... experience, actually getting the team to play together / train together longer while stressing defense is probably the best cure. even the best defender can't make up for mis rotations.



            #30 RollingWave

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              Posted 25 April 2013 - 12:57 PM

              Let me just expand on that comment a little more , this is this year's 5 worst defensive team (pace adjusted).

               

              1.Bobcat

              2.Kings

              3.Hornets

              4.Cavs

              5.Blazers

               

              what's the commonaility of those 5? yeah they're all young teams mostly in the early phase of rebuilding (Portland is a bit further up, but their bench is a disaster .)

               

              It's not a huge secret that rookies and inexperience players in general tend to be the biggest liability in most NBA defense.  yeah there are a few guys who really just don't give a shite about defense or is physically incapable of doing it, but that's VERY rare, most NBA players, if you plug them into the spurs, will do well enough on D, if you plug them into the Kings, they'll be bad.  It's a system thing. and also a experience thing. that the Rockets managed to have a ok defensive rating team this year with a team put together on opening day, mostly inexperienced, and a lot of turn over in the season, is a mini miracle.

               

              Take a look at the Thunders, this was their defense progression since they drafted Durant

               

              2012-13:  4th (which is a good reason why they're very likely to win this year, but unfortunately they are a bit like the 90s Jazz, keep running into a buzzshaw dynasty team.)

              2011-12: 11th

              2010-11: 15th

              2009-10: 9th (outlier)

              2008-09: 20th.

               

               

              it's  pretty clear as day that their defense didn't just showup overnight, they improved a lot over the years, part of that is a stabilized core player that gotten to know each other a lot, and coaching staff that keep working at it.

               

              As I noted, the best defenders can't cover for mis rotations,  and the worst defenders would look pretty good in a good system,  that's just how the NBA defense is, yes there are guys who are better at defense than others, but even more than offense, defense is a team effort.  where as a great scorer can carry a team offesnively to an extend, they simply can't on the other end of the court.

               

              So the biggest thing on being better defensively is to actually keep most of these players together for at least 2-3 years, preferably more like 4-5 years,  and have a coaching staff that preach defense, and can convince everyone to buy into it.

               

              So if you think the idea is to cover James Harden with good defenders and let him do his thing, then it's most likely a recipe for a lot of 1st / 2nd round exit,  Kobe is a bad defender now but he was actually pretty decent when they won, mostly because Phil Jackson manage to make him buy into playing some D too.  if McHale can't get Harden to buy into playing D, then he needs to be fired ,and if others can't do it either, we're looking at a lost cause. But i'm optimistic, mainly because as I pointed out, given this trend, that Houston isn't a utter disastor this year on defense is already a huge sign that McHale and this staff can and do teach defense reasonably well,  another season of this and we could be looking at a pretty solid defensive team, especially if we get a  PF who 's actually tall enough and doesn't foul out in 10 minutes  (hopefully Smith / Jones would improve there if simply by getting less rookie calls on them.)

               

              This off season is really the last chance of making a big move IMHO, and if Dwight Howard or Chris Paul isn't walking through that door, there's a very good argument to make almost no move except making some veteran paddings for the bench. As I pointed out, unless your putting together some spetacularly great defensive players, preferablly already very veteran, the odds are most good defense teams happen because of coach / chemistry / experience.  you can have a good defensive team with that.  and that's probably easier to do than hoping to land a lot of great defenders.






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