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@  majik19 : (13 October 2015 - 09:09 PM) Apparently we claimed Arsalan Kazemi off waivers from the Hawks today... yet another undersized (6'7") power forward for Morey's cupboard.
@  Mario Peña : (10 October 2015 - 01:12 PM) If your part if the Red94 Fantasy Basketball League check the thread to vote for the date and time for the draft event. Thanks y'all!
@  jorgeaam : (07 October 2015 - 08:47 PM) Guys we need 1 more owner for the Red94 fantasy league, if interested please comment on the post in the fantasy basketball thread
@  slick shoes : (07 October 2015 - 06:50 PM) Kobe ranked one spot higher than Ariza? Is this based on legacy or...??
@  slick shoes : (07 October 2015 - 04:13 PM) It was hard to keep up with both the Astros and Rockets at the same time. Should be interesting on Thursday with the Texans and Astros on simultaneously.
@  Mario Peña : (07 October 2015 - 04:09 PM) It was fun to have the Rockets on last night! Right now I'm watching the Celtics versus Milan and Alessandro Gentile is impressive.
@  jorgeaam : (06 October 2015 - 07:47 PM) Well, thinking twice about it, I'd rather have him score less and have the team as a whole do better. Lawson should take a lot of his load off
@  jorgeaam : (06 October 2015 - 07:47 PM) Loving that, hope he hits 30 PPG this year
@  thejohnnygold : (06 October 2015 - 06:15 PM) Someone is feeling confident :) : LINK
@  jorgeaam : (06 October 2015 - 05:54 PM) 10 Teams done, will need 2 more
@  Mario Peña : (06 October 2015 - 02:35 PM) Alright guys, if anyone is interested in joining the Red94 fantasy basketball league we could use one more player to get us to 10 teams (or three to get us to 12 teams). Just check the thread in the Fantasy Basketball forum. Thanks!
@  thejohnnygold : (05 October 2015 - 06:23 PM) I use leaguepass here in Austin with no problems...
@  skip 2 my lou : (05 October 2015 - 03:14 PM) Hey fellas, I'm a rocket fan but I live in the heart of Dallas. Does anybody know if I buy NBA Leaguepass if it's too close to be subject to blackouts?
@  Losthief : (02 October 2015 - 02:24 AM) tks jg
@  thejohnnygold : (29 September 2015 - 05:16 AM) FYI, it was media day today. Interviews are up at NBA.com
@  slick shoes : (23 September 2015 - 06:37 PM) kind of late in the day but NBATV is broadcasting classis Rockets games all day today.
@  SadLakerFan : (16 September 2015 - 04:37 AM) Man, as a Laker fan, I'm learning how little you care about the off season when your team sucks. Anyway, a quick moment to remember Moses. Still remember watching the 81 team as a kid - losing record, NBA Finals. I would have cried w/joy if they could have beaten the Celtics.
@  jorgeaam : (15 September 2015 - 08:30 PM) http://bleacherrepor...ist-after-crash
@  jorgeaam : (15 September 2015 - 08:30 PM) So to celebrate his new contract, Montrezl Harrell saved someone's life on monday
@  thejohnnygold : (14 September 2015 - 04:36 PM) A good article from Blinebury talking about when Hakeem and Moses used to play in the park. LINK

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Is Daryl Morey a Good "Drafter"?


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#21 Guest_RedStewie_*

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 12:10 AM

And for those angry about the draft positions, i feel your pain too. But if we had gotten average picks for one or two years, it would have been the fault of the coach or players. But the fault for being average falls year after year after year after year falls on the gm who put the team together and signed the coach, and also gave them the direction the team would be taking for the season. So his draft position is a direct result of his GM decisions.
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#22 blakecouey

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    Posted 06 July 2012 - 12:24 AM

    There used to be a better site for the information(used actual player accomplishments, not statistical "grouping") but here goes anyways.

    http://www.82games.c...adraftpicks.htm

    It shows what you should "expect" from a certain draft position with stats accumulated from 1989-2008 drafts.

    Im not a fan of this page, but the better page has since gone offline.
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    #23 Guest_RedStewie_*

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    Posted 06 July 2012 - 12:41 AM

    Also look at the typical average minutes for players picked in Budinger and Parson's positions compared to what they are actually getting on the court. More opportunities to produce if u ask me.
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    #24 Jeby

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      Posted 06 July 2012 - 01:29 AM

      The standard for "is Daryl Morey a good drafter?" should be "has he gotten value out of the picks he has used?" The context of the question was, can Morey rebuild through high draft picks (top 10 picks) if this year's (and maybe next year's) team fails to be competitive?
      I think the answer is yes.
      Or to put it in more practical terms, I don't think Les Alexander could fire Morey and hire somebody better at that whose name is not Sam Presti or R.C. Buford.
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      "Assets" -- Daryl Morey

      #25 Guest_RedStewie_*

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      Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:06 AM

      The above post lacks logic
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      #26 Dan G

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      Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:25 AM

      And for those angry about the draft positions, i feel your pain too. But if we had gotten average picks for one or two years, it would have been the fault of the coach or players. But the fault for being average falls year after year after year after year falls on the gm who put the team together and signed the coach, and also gave them the direction the team would be taking for the season. So his draft position is a direct result of his GM decisions.


      I personally think Morey is an above average drafter and I don't necessarily agree with it is automatically the fault of the GM if you get average picks year after year after year. Yes some of the fault goes to the GM, but if the owner wants a competitive team year in and year out, a good bit of the fault lies on him too. The GM typically wants to keep his job and if the owner says stay competitive or you're fired, then it is highly likely the GM will attempt to stay competitive.

      Also, I know this is going to sound crazy but if there is "blame" left over, one would also have to blame potential season ticket holders or people who go to live games. Since that is a good chunk of revenue for owners, I bet Les likes to stay competitive not only because winning is better than losing but if the Rockets start to lose, he will lose out in $$$ too. Even though Houston has a big market, they tend not to support their teams by going to games if they suck. Maybe if Houston had a fan base more like Golden state or Portland in recent years in which even though they might suck, they still sell out more often than not, Les might be more inclined to tank a few seasons in hopes of finally landing that Star through the draft.

      I can't say anything because even though I'm a diehard Rockets, Astros and Texans fan, I'm one of the worst about going to live games if they more than likely will lose. I feel my situation is a little different though as I live 2 1/2 hours away, drive a mini-van that only gets 21 MPG on the highway, and I like to sit relatively close (I sit in the best seat at MMP- Sec. 119) so I have quite a bit time and money invested each time I go and I fully expect them to win the majority of the time if I go because I CAN'T stand to watch them lose.

      For instance, I haven't been to an Astros game in years and I don't expect to go to one anytime soon until the owner is willing to cough up money to put out a competitive ball club. Until then I will keep my money and not waste my time watching the team live if they will not be competitive. However, I probably would go to a Rockets game as long as they stay competitive, and probably won't if they start tanking.
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      :lol: All in the game, yo, :D all in the game :lol:!


      #27 ale11

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      Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:59 AM

      70% of the fault is Les', because he wanted to stay competitive, and if Morey did his homework right when it comes to trade (or not), goes in another thread. Having said that, he had to pick what he could (like somebody said, never above 12th). I don't think he is a bad drafter (nor "above average", at least not yet), let's see what he pulls off with two top 10 picks.

      Unluckily for him, he might not get that chance in Houston, it all depends on how good are this year picks and what kind of future we see in them (one thing is to suck completely and another totally different is to die with your boots on). That difference is gonna show whether he made good picks or not the last two years, the only one who played several minutes was Parsons and turned out pretty good, let's see the rest before jumping to any definitive conclusion.

      For that, I give him a B minus (for now, waiting to see the whole bunch).
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      #28 Dan G

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      Posted 06 July 2012 - 03:15 AM

      For that, I give him a B minus (for now, waiting to see the whole bunch).


      B minus is above average unless you think the average GM's drafting ability is at a B minus, and if that is the case, I think you're handing out too many As.
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      :lol: All in the game, yo, :D all in the game :lol:!


      #29 ale11

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      Posted 06 July 2012 - 03:21 AM

      The grading system in my country isn't the same as yours, lol. Let's say it has been "slightly above average" (in my opinion).

      The A's are Buford and Presti, obviously. I don't think Morey is as good as they are, but he could be B+ or D depending on how these guys turn out for us.
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      #30 pharmag

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        Posted 06 July 2012 - 03:31 AM

        The grading system in my country isn't the same as yours, lol. Let's say it has been "slightly above average" (in my opinion).

        The A's are Buford and Presti, obviously. I don't think Morey is as good as they are, but he could be B+ or D depending on how these guys turn out for us.


        I agree. He has done relatively well so far but the only picks that have really been in the league long enough to make a judgement on were picked in the late 20s or later. Guys like Patterson, Morris, lamb, white, and jones will have a big effect on his drafting grade but they haven't been in the league long enough yet to truly evaluate.
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        #31 Guest_RedStewie_*

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        Posted 06 July 2012 - 04:13 AM

        Morey's apologists will always have an excuse for Morey even when evidence points to otherwise.
        He's a terrible drafter- no, we have always had terrible picks
        He's an ok gm who can't put together a contender- no, he is trying his best
        He can't get marquee free agents- those free agents did not want to come to houston
        Morey always lowblows players during contracts- well, he pays them what he thinks they r worth
        Our team with Morey has always been filled with undersized cheap unskilled hustle players- He puts up a competitive team.
        He has had enough time since being assistant in 06 and taking over in 07- what? its only been 5 years, give him time
        A team Morey constructed from scratch has never made the playoffs- that's not fair, he was building around Yao
        The team has terrible scouts and evaluator- what, we produced chandler parsons and budinger

        Morey has had 5 years, 6 seasons. Is it him or is it Les. If its Les, then it means Les is not ready to win, but is happy a long as he can turn up a profit. But when i see Morey's name on the news making trades and being lauded as the smartest man in sports, i have to wonder "how come he gets all the praise, and les gets the blame" or is it a joint venture.
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        #32 Jeby

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          Posted 06 July 2012 - 04:50 AM

          Morey's apologists will always have an excuse for Morey even when evidence points to otherwise.


          I don't think it's a matter of being an apologist for Morey. In my opinion, when it comes to attracting good free agents and swinging deals for All-star players* he clearly has a track-record of failure. But he has shown a knack for finding good players in the draft that other teams have overlooked (Brooks, Landry, Parsons, Budinger). If the team is headed toward rebuilding through the draft, that's a good quality for the GM to have.

          *debatable because of the Gasol trade and David Stern's veto.
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          "Assets" -- Daryl Morey

          #33 pharmag

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            Posted 06 July 2012 - 12:44 PM

            Morey's apologists will always have an excuse for Morey even when evidence points to otherwise.
            He's a terrible drafter- no, we have always had terrible picks
            He's an ok gm who can't put together a contender- no, he is trying his best
            He can't get marquee free agents- those free agents did not want to come to houston
            Morey always lowblows players during contracts- well, he pays them what he thinks they r worth
            Our team with Morey has always been filled with undersized cheap unskilled hustle players- He puts up a competitive team.
            He has had enough time since being assistant in 06 and taking over in 07- what? its only been 5 years, give him time
            A team Morey constructed from scratch has never made the playoffs- that's not fair, he was building around Yao
            The team has terrible scouts and evaluator- what, we produced chandler parsons and budinger

            Morey has had 5 years, 6 seasons. Is it him or is it Les. If its Les, then it means Les is not ready to win, but is happy a long as he can turn up a profit. But when i see Morey's name on the news making trades and being lauded as the smartest man in sports, i have to wonder "how come he gets all the praise, and les gets the blame" or is it a joint venture.


            And you lack the capacity to look at his drafting in context (or at least that's the impression your posts give). You want to judge Morey by how many all-stars and solid starters he has drafted. However, if you had actually looked at that table that Blake posted, you would notice that starting with the 25th pick (which from 2007-2009 was the highest pick he ever had), about 75% of those players become deep bench, bust, or DNP players. Yet he has managed to find role players with almost every single one of those picks (2008 being an exception and an all around bad draft, but the pieces drafted were used to get Ron Artest). In that span, only Jermaine Taylor would probably fall into the 75% as Llull and Leunen are still in Europe so no real judgment can be made.

            Context is key to this entire debate. If you want to throw context out the window and base Morey's drafting ability on how many all-stars and solid starters he got, then go right ahead. However, you are probably not going to get most people to agree with you because most people understand that you rarely find all-stars and only occasionally find a solid starters with the picks that comprise 63% of Morey's draft history, and of the other 37% of his history, 25% haven't even hit an NBA court.
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            #34 Lyfestyle

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              Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:12 PM

              Context is key to this entire debate. If you want to throw context out the window and base Morey's drafting ability on how many all-stars and solid starters he got, then go right ahead. However, you are probably not going to get most people to agree with you because most people understand that you rarely find all-stars and only occasionally find a solid starters with the picks that comprise 63% of Morey's draft history, and of the other 37% of his history, 25% haven't even hit an NBA court.


              You with your numbers and context. RedStewie doesn't need any of that - he's got his gut. He's the George W. Bush of these forums.
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              #35 Guest_RedStewie_*

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              Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:12 PM

              u sound like a morey apologist pharmag
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              #36 Guest_RedStewie_*

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              Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:17 PM

              You with your numbers and context. RedStewie doesn't need any of that - he's got his gut. He's the George W. Bush of these forums.

              what numbers, i first posted those names before blake confirmed it because someone else asked to show him which good players have been taken after the #14, seems like the argument have deviated from that.

              Taking what out of context, if Morey is a good drafter, he would have found value at whatever position. So, if all he can do it draft whats available despite stocking up all those picks and buying multiple 2nd round picks, then at best, he's an average drafter playing the hand he was dealt. He is not unearthing anyone special. Again, IT IS NOT MY FAULT WE HAVE TERRIBLE PICKS EVERY YEAR, SO YALL QUIT WITH THAT BOGUS ARGUMENT
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              #37 ale11

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              Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:24 PM

              I said both of them were to blame. The thing is that Morey's acts are dictated by Les' demands. It's not like Morey can do whatever he wants, he has been given instructions (that were ok for a year or two, but we have been stuck for a while now trying to "stay competitive", and that's more Les' fault).

              Like I said before, Morey hasn't been great, but given the circumstances, he did what he could with the weapons given....and it wasn't all that bad. I don't defend him, I simply just don't crucify him for not picking an All-Star at 14th or beyond.

              Who of you thought we shuold have picked Gasol or Hibbert at that moment, having Yao on our roster? It's really easy to judge now that Yao is retired, please be honest, you really wanted Gasol or Hibbert AT THAT MOMENT? Don't think so.
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              #38 Lyfestyle

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                Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:38 PM

                IT IS NOT MY FAULT WE HAVE TERRIBLE PICKS EVERY YEAR, SO YALL QUIT WITH THAT BOGUS ARGUMENT


                It's not a bogus argument. You're acting as though it's a footrace where everyone starts at the same place and has the same chance at success. It's a very simplistic way to look at a rather complex thing. The fact that Morey's drafted Landry, Brooks, Budinger and Parsons should show you he's at the very least decent at drafting, but you won't even grant him that. You're seemingly incapable of being objective and it makes you seem like a bomb-thrower rather than a serious commenter.
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                #39 Guest_RedStewie_*

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                Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:47 PM

                where are those players he drafted Lyfestyle.
                Landry is a backup on a terrible new orleans teams
                Budinger is trash
                Brooks was the only bright spot, but Morey tried to lowball him and had to move him. Plus he is severely undersized at any position.
                Parsons is a hustle no skill player.
                Morey and les were the one that chose to remain competitive with a crappy team resulting in those terrible picks, but its not like he made a chicken sandwich from chicken shit. At best, he drafted average at an average position.

                Who of you thought we shuold have picked Gasol or Hibbert at that moment, having Yao on our roster? It's really easy to judge now that Yao is retired, please be honest, you really wanted Gasol or Hibbert AT THAT MOMENT? Don't think so.

                I thought Morey said his job was to pick the best player available regardless of position.
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                #40 Alituro

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                  Posted 06 July 2012 - 02:50 PM

                  I think we really need to reserve judgment until the jury is out on this years picks and what happens to Pat and Morris, both who have not reached their ceiling. As said, Bud, Brooks, Landry and Parsons were excellent picks at their spots, Taylor and Dorsey were not. So, so far I'd tend to call it a C to B- grade, just based on those six. If Pat and Morris turn out to be busts, then his grade slides to a big fat F. It's these more recent picks that came in the teens of the first round, and this year in bulk, that should be the real barometer, as well as what happens to the players selected in that range to other teams (Zeller). If Morris and the 3 new rookies get some play time this season on our way to (hopefully) #30 in the standings, then we'll be able to make a more accurate judgment. Even more and more serious scrutiny will be in order if we're to be able to obtain a top 5 in a year from now. But, as far as starting a "Fire Morey!" campaign... What's the point now if we're trying to lose anyway? I do, however agree that for the next 2 years he should be put on a probation (of sorts) for his inability to produce through trades and signings of late.
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