158 replies to this topic

[phaketrash]

<sub>@Kade

I have to agree with JohnnyGold. That is a big reason why I struggle w/ your assertions Kade (besides my disagreement on how inept you believe Morey is). You are too vague in your points, or rather, it lacks support. Give us something concrete like what JG did. Tell us SPECIFICALLY the acts Morey did incorrectly and THEN supplement that with what he could have/should have done instead. Top it off with the list of GMs (that I am still waiting for) who are clearly better than Morey and did not make those mistakes/would not make those mistakes. I'm sure Presti makes your list, but who else?

Because even if you can point out all of Morey's mistakes, if there aren't many GMs better than him...what's the point? What are the specific alternatives? If you're upset about the direction Morey is taking us, at least provide some direction in your own criticisms of him.</sub>

[LMAOwais]

I think one thing that hasn't been brought up, is with every move Morey has been incredibly flexible imo, especially when it comes to mistakes like Trevor Ariza, David Andersen, or Terrence Williams. So bad moves because they didn't pan out? Yes, but he has never tied himself down with these mistakes and has always been able to parlay them into something else rather quickly.

Also, success aside, Morey is an intelligent man, and I would be hard pressed to find other GMs in the field who have shown the ability to put together a competitive (albeit mediocre) team consistently with the restraints that have reigned in Morey. And its been presented here again and again that Morey would rather have tanked in line with Kade's desire but Les disapproved and I think you've been glossing over that all too easily while arguing against him.

[ale11]

I don't think that bringing Ariza was all that Morey's fault rather than Artest forcing his way out and bringing back the only player that the Lakers were willing to give up.

I don't see his tenure with the Rockets as a failure since only one team wins the ring, the other 29 teams are necessarily failures. There are lots of different contexts around the league, such as small markets or unappealing cities to live in, even teams with poor basketball history. Houston isn't exactly a top team adding up those conditions, so that must be an obstacle to overcome. Some places are more prone to allure top players, whether you like it or not.

It's also valid to think that "tanking-drafting-developing talent" process it's the steadier way to get to be a contender over a forseeable future, but although that requires scouting and skill, that also requires a huge amount of luck. OKC's case is one of a kind, SA had Duncan under Robinson's wing and then they brought great talent from overseas (Parker, Ginobili). Those are probably the only two teams who are currently contenders with those players who drafted themselves, the other ones got to that status with other assets above mentioned, such as wallet, history or marketability. So, given that premise, the only two better GM's than Morey are Presti and Buford/Popovich.
Also, tanking isn't a guarantee of getting top talent. An even so, it's not a guarantee of a great present. Cleveland had two picks last draft within the first 5, that didn't make them near contenders, they are still one of the worse teams in the league. Sacramento is a train wreck, Washington sucks (they suck less since they traded for Nene and Okafor but had bad luck with Wall's injury). Charlotte is Charlotte. Hell, even Portland had bad luck with injuries. NOLA may have a great future, but Gordon came through trade, not drafted by them and without him, they weren't any great right now. LUCK IS ALMOST AS IMPORTANT AS ABILITY, PERIOD.

I'll grant you that McHale might not be the best choice for our team given our current staff and our youth, but that's a judgement that might be more suitable once this season (or maybe next one) comes to an end.

I'm not going to comment about White because that was a gamble all along, sometimes it pans out, sometimes not. This time didn't, but our future wasn't really depending on that 16th pick. The gamble consisted on getting a high risk/high reward player or having someone less talented with a probably much lower ceilling. I really don't judge that pick, even if I'm upset about his baby attitude.

To sum up, I believe that we are on the right track, at least for now. I think there's no urgency for a makeover, because right now our future looks brighter than ever since we drafted Yao. We as fans need to accept that not all 30 teams can win championships on a regular basis, so we must be patient and not see failing to be contenders as a failure. Every context is different.

[datruth]

Coaches should know there strenghts and weaknesses of their team. This team has been poorly prepared this year. No plan from game to game. Morey, not sure if it's all on him. He made so good moves in the off season, but Mchale and Sampson is destroying this team. Harden great talent indeed, but before this year he average around 14 points a game and this was over a period of three years. He improved every year for three years so that means someone worked with him to get better. Mchale used to be great post up player, but this team has no post presence at all. Just, because you are a great player does not mean you will be a great leader or coach. Many great players do not have communications skills or patience to develope players. Harden was in OKC system for three years. I'm not sure if Durant, Westbrook, Harden and Serge would win with Mchale. Development of anything takes time. Mchale is not the answer with for this team. A young coach with patience and good x and O's skills is the answer this team is looking for. A young team and young players have there up and downs. You don't tell ESPN during a halftime break you only have one play maker on your team and that Harden. So did Brooks say that when he had all three players on the same team. No other coach does the the things that Mchale does. You can't keep degrading your players and expect that to build confiedence or wins.

[Matt Maloney's Ghost]

Maybe Kade should just move to Sac-Town, DC, or Charlotte. If you want to sit around and be miserable with a crappy franchise and idiotic GMs, you should really think about moving to those destinations.

What annoys me the most about your points is that you make sound like Morey's mistakes are so bad. Morey's success shine brighter through the dark clouds of his failures. We have JAMES HARDEN. I have no doubts that Morey will be able to build around him. This is an exciting time! The Rockets have the capabilities to swing a deal for a star at any time. Every morning when I wake up, I brace myself before I check the news. We may be the 8th seed, but our future is brighter than ever before.

Im glad we never tanked.

[thejohnnygold]

It seems most of us agree that Mchale needs to show something by the end of this season.

I was looking for some coaches that might work well for us....

Maurice Cheeks

Larry Brown

Brian Shaw

Mike Budenholzer

Jerry Sloan

Not sure how I would rank them top to bottom....I think each would have a positive, but unique, effect on the team. I think Brian Shaw seems ready to show the league a big "eff you!" for getting passed over so many times.

Brown is a proven commodity. Sloan would take our pick and roll and make it unstoppable. I think Cheeks might be my #2 choice after Shaw...no reason why...just feels right. Of course, Budenholzer learning from Popovich.....even if he is only 80% the coach Pop is...that is better than most.

Oh, and I did not forget Phil Jackson. That dude is a decent x & o guy, but c'mon....don't fall for the smoke and mirrors. He has had a gluttony of talent to "coach" with.

Any other coaches I forgot/overlooked?

[Mario Peña]

I am voting for McHale. I like him as the Rockets' coach and hope he stays the full duration of his contract. I think he fits with what is going on presently. This season was his first time to run a team through camp and the preseason and he did fine in my opinion. And I would not be surprised if he is even better next season as a coach.

[bboley24]

I agree with Matt Maloney up there...

Kade, you really should be sticking with these teams that tank year after year. If that doesn't give you any insight as to why Morey is doing his job right then you have no hope as a Rocket fan.

[Alituro]

Having any expectations for this team, this season AT ALL, is just setting yourself up for disappointment. There's no need to do whatever possible to win more games, there's no need to blow up the roster because we did so less than a year ago. There's no need to fire the coach (yet) seeing as how he had a diminished season and roster last year and a whole new (and VERY young) roster this year, even the greatest coaches would need at least a full season to become acclimated. There's no need to fire the GM because he recently blew up a sorry roster, got us a bonafide star, got through last years draft with a 67% success rate (so far, if White comes around maybe 100%), made a couple steals in the offseason with Asik (definitely) and Lin (hopefully), found a serviceable PG in Beverley from overseas, signed an undrafted back-up center who is among the top in the league among bench players in FG% and we are left with enough cap space to basically add whomever comes along that will fit our needs. Sure a 7 game losing street will leave a bad taste in anybody's mouth, but,(see first sentence). WTF is there to complain about?

[thejohnnygold]

@Alituro, I presume you are directing that mostly at Kade. I don't mean to start a campaign against McHale. I like to see people succeed. That being said, I am not convinced he has what it takes to succeed with the Rockets. As I said before, he needs to show something by the end of the season. It doesn't have to be in the win-loss column. I would like to see overall improvement in the players themselves as well as the way they are used and work together. To me, that would show McHale is worth keeping around. I believe we have talent at every position (including the PF's) and it takes a good coach to turn those ingredients into the right meal.

[Alituro]

@thejohnnygold yes, was directed @Kade. I agree with you 100% as you do me, McHale deserves the benefit of the doubt at least for the whole season, no need at all to axe him midway through, but he needs his full chance and he hasn't got it yet, as of now. There's also the fact that the Rockets have been one of the biggest revolving doors in the league for the past decade for coaches and players alike. This has to wear on our reputation league-wide as far as making us an attractive destination for anyone. The sooner we can lock into our core of players and coaches and stick with them for some time, the quicker that perception begins to erode away. Replacing the GM in these formative years will only perpetuate that problem.

[PKM]

@johnny: Brown would be a terrible fit for a young rotation, half of the Rockets fan would riot if Sloan was picked ( and I would be among that half), I don't think Budenholzer will leave the Spurs ( I believe Pop has said he will retire when Duncan does so Budenholzer could very well succeed him), and I'm somewhat iffy on Shaw given what a disaster Rambis was in Minnesota. Don't know anything about Cheeks, however.

[thejohnnygold]

@Alituro - Agree with all that. Besides, McHale still has more years on his contract. No point in paying two coaches at once if you don't have to.

@PKM - I didn't even think about the Sloan "hatred" in Houston...probably should have. I have always respected him and hated his players instead. Either way, it is just some fun speculation...I think we will see Mchale here through 2014 at least....for better or worse.

[hubeijames]

I am voting for McHale. I like him as the Rockets' coach and hope he stays the full duration of his contract. I think he fits with what is going on presently. This season was his first time to run a team through camp and the preseason and he did fine in my opinion. And I would not be surprised if he is even better next season as a coach.

Gotta agree. The way the team is wobbling right now isn't the fault of the coach or the front office. It's simply the inconsistency you should expect from such a young, mostly raw but very talented group. Seven games ago we were singing McHale's praises, admiring how quickly the team had turned around after he came back from his leave. It isn't really McHale's fault when 3 of our top 4 scoring options go on a cold streak at the same time (and that's why we're seeing the Harden hero ball return; there's no other choice when no one else can score).

[rocketrick]

If I may be so bold, I predict this is the last we'll hear out of Kade in this thread. Just like in the previous thread started on his behalf "In Morey We Trust", Kade will go ballistic then absolute silence as he has no good answers for many questions and opinions provided by other more knowledgeable Red94 posters.

As mentioned earlier today, Royce White could still be salvageable. Why would anyone want to fire McHale, he has been in the Rockets organization barely for a year now. Last season there was no pre-season camp due to the NBA lockout. So he had to wing it last year for the entire season and we just barely missed the playoffs. Then practically the entire roster gets blown up at the start of this season. Everyone knows the sad situation with his daughter, Sasha, that cost him about 1 month of this season as he had to take a leave of absence. Then all this crap from Kade about Morey is asinine in my opinion. Morey had very little wriggle room the first 2-3 seasons due to the McGrady and Yao contracts and he did as good as anyone could have in filling out the roster with limited resources. This is really the second season that Morey has complete control of the roster and the Rockets salary situation. And this season is obviously only about 1/2 complete.

I have no doubt whatsoever that many posters on Red94 want the same thing as Les Alexander and Daryl Morey, that being NBA championships. For Kade to call us out for supposedly accepting mediocrity is absolute BS. As mentioned plenty of times the past 2-3 weeks, only 1 NBA organization wins the trophy at the end of the year. According to Kade, every other GM and Head Coach should be fired if their organization doesn't win the championship. How ridiculous and short-sighted is that?

Anyway, I predict this is the last we'll hear from Kade for some time until he decides to start a new thread hoping that everyone will forget who he was and he'll continue making his same old arguments and continue not answering direct questions posed to him including who he would consider available to hire as Morey's replacement.

[rocketrick]

I am voting for McHale. I like him as the Rockets' coach and hope he stays the full duration of his contract. I think he fits with what is going on presently. This season was his first time to run a team through camp and the preseason and he did fine in my opinion. And I would not be surprised if he is even better next season as a coach.

I agree 100% with FSS. Coach McHale needs to be given an opportunity to show what he can do. His first season was right after the NBA lockout and so he had no opportunity to implement his schemes before the start of last season. Then practically the entire roster gets blown up by the start of this season including the last minute trade for Harden which prevented any pre-season work on developing new schemes around Harden. Then the unfortunate death of Coach McHale's beautiful daughter, Sasha, which required Coach McHale to take a leave of absence for a significant portion of time just shortly after the season had gone underway..

Players look up to and are willing to be lead by a proven winner. Coach McHale won several NBA Championships as a player with the Celtics so if anyone knows what it takes to become a champion, it surely is someone like a Coach McHale. I believe that more than anything is why Les Alexander chose to hire him.

C'mon guys, don't be so shortsighted. Let's give the Rockets time to jell before asking for changes.

[rocketrick]

Rockets are bottom 10 in attendance and sliding. Most business men who are successful have to look at the big picture. Year after year with same results will see a steady decline in attendance = decline in sales

If Kade can do better, then perhaps he should apply to sell tickets for the Rockets!!

I am fact checking Kade on his statement as well. As it turns out, due to many NBA teams having larger arenas than the Rockets Toyota Center, it will always be impossible for the Rockets to ever be a top 12 franchise in total home attendance (unless everybody else sucks so bad nobody attends games in those cities). A good link to verify this fact is http://www.espn.go.com/nba/attendance

Next season, it appears Seattle will replace Sacramento making yet another arena larger than Houston's Toyota Center.

The Rockets are currently filling their arena to nearly 90% capacity and I believe as their roster matures and as their problematic sports channel finally goes live on all providers, their attendance will likely improve throughout this season and into the future.

[DaDakota]

I may not totally agree with the op, but I do agree with one thing.

McHale is gawd awful as a coach, you watch other teams with their player movement, and then I watch the crap the Rockets are running and it is sickening.

Watch how Denver plays without a legitimate star and how they play team ball.

I thought we were hiring Finch to keep Adelman's offense, wtf happened?

As for Morey - he hired McHale, this is completely his team and coaching staff, he also has to be held accountable.

While I know this is a young team, they are NOT playing the rookies to develop them, it just seems like more of the same, a mediocre team, treading water, while potential upside is sitting on the bench waiting to be traded.

I really don't like the way this team and coaching staff is put together.

YUCK !

DD

[phaketrash]

I'm sort of on the McHale-hating bandwagon now, and I guess Morey does have to be a bit faulted w/ that hire...but hey, at least he's not D'Antoni! (as much as he pretends to be )

[Hakeem DaDream]

When a Rocket is substituted for, coming to the sideline/bench, McHale doesn't talk with the player coming out or even make eye contact. Watch Pops ,even Tony Parker gets instruction from Pops after coming out. Nothing from McHale. Players look like they ave given up.